11-16-2005, 17:20
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#1
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Area Commander
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 1,403
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Third-World Medical Care and Child Amputees
My cousin is a contractor for a PMC in A'stan and is going to Kashmir on his time off to fly in relief supplies (helo pilot). Many, many head injuries and extremity crush injuries in kids are reported. There have been many field expedient amputations. He asked me to look into books for handling these injuries and I found a web site that has free online books in pdf format such as Where There Is No Doctor, Where There Is No Dentist, Disabled Village Children, etc. This is particularly helpful as he can pull these down over there and print them locally.
Here's the link --> http://www.healthwrights.org/booksonline.htm
Can anyone recommend any other online materials -- books, FMs, etc. -- that deal with this topic? If you know of any particularly useful hard copy I can get these to him as well.
Thanks in advance.
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mugwump is offline
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11-17-2005, 09:20
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#2
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Asset
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 49
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To what level is the providers trained? There is several good books if one have advanced training. If its for non ALS trained then "Save Lives, Save Limbs" is a must have. Its a "Where there is no trauma doctor" and have lots of good info.
For ALS providers:
War Surgery by Hans Husum
Primary Surgery vol 1-non trauma and vol 2 trauma(vol 1 is online without any pics)
Primary Anesthesia
Anesthesia at the district hospital (online)
Surgery at the district hospital (online)
Last edited by SwedeGlocker; 11-17-2005 at 12:59.
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SwedeGlocker is offline
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11-17-2005, 10:12
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#3
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Area Commander
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 1,403
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by SwedeGlocker
To what level is the providers trained?
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I assume all levels of training below physician, but that's just a guess. He has a friend who was an 18D who he frequently bums around with. I'm guessing there will be others with medic training.
Many thanks for the references - I will get right on it ordering these and will pass on the online URLs.
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mugwump is offline
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11-17-2005, 12:39
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#4
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Free Pineland
Posts: 24,827
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by mugwump
I assume all levels of training below physician, but that's just a guess. He has a friend who was an 18D who he frequently bums around with. I'm guessing there will be others with medic training.
Many thanks for the references - I will get right on it ordering these and will pass on the online URLs.
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Tell him to get a copy of the SOF Medical Handbook.
TR
__________________
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat." - President Theodore Roosevelt, 1910
De Oppresso Liber 01/20/2025
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The Reaper is offline
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11-17-2005, 13:08
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#5
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Asset
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 49
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I agree that the SOF medical handbook is great but not for this. It dosent cover any subject att depth and does require training in eath subject before one can use it. There is also several errors in for example the anesthesia chapter. The aboved mention books with the addition of "Oxford handbook of tropical medicine" is a far better choice for civilian medical missons. If there is space and weight limitations then then the SOF handbook can be an opion.
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SwedeGlocker is offline
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11-17-2005, 13:37
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#6
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Tampa
Posts: 2,535
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Well...folks who have "seen it on TV" shouldn't be doing it anyway. I "used to do this" and "downloaded this video series or that book" should stick to second guessing episodes of ER.
For the one kid they fix-there will be 10 that they kill "learning on"
My .02-
Sorry...this is pretty near and dear after sitting through lectures oin Ped trauma in SW Asia and the case reports of "redundant surgical intervention after good samaritan deeds"
Eagle
__________________
Primum non Nocere
"I have hung out in dangerous places a lot over the years, from combat zones to biker bars, and it is the weak, the unaware, or those looking for it, that usually find trouble.
Ain't no one getting out of this world alive. All you can do is try to have some choice in the way you go. Prepare yourself (and your affairs), and when your number is up, die on your feet fighting rather than on your knees. And make the SOBs pay dearly."
The Reaper-3 Sep 04
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Eagle5US is offline
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11-17-2005, 14:50
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#7
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Area Commander
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 1,403
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Eagle5US
Well...folks who have "seen it on TV" shouldn't be doing it anyway. I "used to do this" and "downloaded this video series or that book" should stick to second guessing episodes of ER.
For the one kid they fix-there will be 10 that they kill "learning on"
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Eagle, I don't want this to sound smartass because this is your house and I agree with what you are saying in principle. But I think the point is they aren't just sitting around second-guessing ER episodes. My cousin has BTDT and has the 3 ex-wives to prove it.  This is his second pass through the area -- he's using his well-earned time off to fly for no pay at high elevations, in winter, through gusty mountain passes to try to get aid to areas that have seen none.
Granted, the situation is less than optimal. I think there are a whole lot of tough choices being made. He's telling me of kids trapped under unmoveable slabs who were chopped out by their parents with axes. This is pretty much the definition of "between a rock and a hard place." He's not qualified to do it, but he still has to perform triage when he has 60 frantic parents with seriously injured kids and room for eight in the helo. The more he knows, the better he'll feel.
He asked for help, so I'm doing the best I can for him. He's the most dedicated and capable guy I've met. I'm sure you'd like him if you met him, if you haven't met him already. What I don't have the heart to tell him, although my guess is that he already knows, is he won't be coping with the numbers of seriously injured on the next trip. They'll all be dead.
He's a pretty tough guy but I can tell he's really shaken by what he's seen. He thinks the optimal solution is to evac the whole valley system, but it isn't being done for political reasons.
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mugwump is offline
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11-17-2005, 16:35
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#8
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Tampa
Posts: 2,535
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I understand your point-
but I don't have to like it.  :
Eagle
__________________
Primum non Nocere
"I have hung out in dangerous places a lot over the years, from combat zones to biker bars, and it is the weak, the unaware, or those looking for it, that usually find trouble.
Ain't no one getting out of this world alive. All you can do is try to have some choice in the way you go. Prepare yourself (and your affairs), and when your number is up, die on your feet fighting rather than on your knees. And make the SOBs pay dearly."
The Reaper-3 Sep 04
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Eagle5US is offline
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11-17-2005, 18:32
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#9
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Area Commander
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 1,403
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Thanks for the imput. I'll try to get him to show up here, I'm sure he'd profit from your point of view.
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mugwump is offline
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11-18-2005, 01:52
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#10
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FTFSI
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: LA
Posts: 1
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There are alot of "books" and experts....
The bottom line on most surgical wounds in austere conditions is leave the wound open, clean it often and make sure that the nutrition of the patient is optimized, dont put anything (solution ointment) in a wound that you would not put in your eye.
when your friends get back have them train with DAMN
check out the website www.directationmedialnetwork.com
These guys are all MDs with surgery backgrounds and train operators (medical and nonmedical) in enhancing the human weapon system and to deal with medical issues down range.
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snapper is offline
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11-18-2005, 08:21
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#11
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Free Pineland
Posts: 24,827
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by snapper
There are alot of "books" and experts....
The bottom line on most surgical wounds in austere conditions is leave the wound open, clean it often and make sure that the nutrition of the patient is optimized, dont put anything (solution ointment) in a wound that you would not put in your eye.
when your friends get back have them train with DAMN
check out the website www.direcactionmedialnetwork.com
These guys are all MDs with surgery backgrounds and train operators (medical and nonmedical) in enhancing the human weapon system and to deal with medical issues down range. |
Snapper:
Please have the courtesy to read the stickies, fill out your profile and introduce yourself in the proper place before dispensing any more medical advice or posting on this board again.
Plugging your company without permission is also frowned on here.
Tha Management
__________________
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat." - President Theodore Roosevelt, 1910
De Oppresso Liber 01/20/2025
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