08-06-2010, 15:01
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#16
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Quiet Professional (RIP)
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Carriere,Ms.
Posts: 6,922
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Reaper
The average load of an 82nd Airborne infantryman in theater is in excess of 130 pounds.
I do not recommend training with that weight, but it is reality.
How much of your share of the team gear do you think your fellow team members should have to carry for you?
If you are in good shape at 135 pounds, you had best be the strongest 135 pound man on the planet, and be able to buddy carry the heaviest guy on your team when you have to.
TR
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OK guys,I'm not the brightest guy on this forum,however please tell me how a 135 pound guy would be able to carry a 130 pound rucksack?............. 
Big Teddy 
__________________
I believe that SF is a 'calling' - not too different from the calling missionaries I know received. I knew instantly that it was for me, and that I would do all I could to achieve it. Most others I know in SF experienced something similar. If, as you say, you HAVE searched and read, and you do not KNOW if this is the path for you --- it is not....
Zonie Diver
SF is a calling and it requires commitment and dedication that the uninitiated will never understand......
Jack Moroney
SFA M-2527, Chapter XXXVII
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greenberetTFS is offline
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08-06-2010, 15:27
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#17
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Free Pineland
Posts: 24,822
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greenberetTFS
OK guys,I'm not the brightest guy on this forum,however please tell me how a 135 pound guy would be able to carry a 130 pound rucksack?.............
Big Teddy |
Teddy:
It isn't a 130 pound ruck, at least not normally.
Body armor, helmet, weapon, ammo, grenades, smoke, crew served ammo, water, chow, radio, spare batteries, NVG, snivel gear, sleeping gear (temps ranged from 40s to more than 110 degrees), uniform, knife, tools, compass, map, flashlight, first aid/blow-out kit, IV kits, hygiene kits, gloves, etc., etc., plus a ruck adds up to 130 plus pounds.
Frankly, having humped over 150 pounds load before, when I weighed 190, it isn't exactly a tactical movement. More like a struggle to put one foot in front of the other without falling, eyes on the ground.
This study shows you where the weight comes from.
http://thedonovan.com/archives/moder...LoadReport.pdf
Here goes:
Quote:
Rifleman.
Average Mission Duration: 48-72 hours
Resupply Items: Soldiers were resupplied with 2-3 MREs per day and up to 8 liters of water per
day. When under fire, Soldiers could expect a resupply of their basic load of ammunition each
day.
Duty Position: Rifleman
Average Fighting Load (lbs): 63.00 lbs
Average FL % Body Weight: 35.90%
Average Approach March Load (lbs): 95.67 lbs
Average AML % Body Weight: 54.72%
Average Emergency Approach March Load (lbs): 127.34 lbs
Average EAML % Body Weight: 71.41 %
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Hell, the study shows the 60mm mortar crews and leaders, assistance machine gunner, MG ammo bearer, and SAW gunners all over 140 pounds, and in some cases, almost 150 pounds.
The items counted for the 11B look like this. No beer, ipods, cigarettes, etc. included.
Quote:
Equipment Common to Riflemen:
A. Worn on Body/Uniform:
• M4 Carbine with PEQ-2 Laser/PAQ-4 Laser, ACOG/CCO, and 30 rounds of 5.56mm ball
ammunition.
• Desert Camouflage Uniform with Infrared Tape on left sleeve (1”x1”).
• Desert Combat Boots.
• Dog Tags.
• ID Card.
• Undershirt.
• Socks.
• Tactical gloves.
• Interceptor Body Armor with two Small Arms Protective Inserts.
• Advanced Combat Helmet with night vision mounting plate.
• Rigger belt.
• Notebook and pen.
• Watch.
• Knee and elbow pads.
• Sun, Sand, and Dust type Goggles or Wiley-X Goggles.
• Folding Knife/Multi-tool.
B. Worn on Fighting Load Carrier/Interceptor Body Armor:
• MOLLE Fighting Load Carrier with modular MOLLE pouches.
• 180 rounds of 5.56mm ball ammunition.
• Bayonet.
• Fragmentation grenade.
• 64 ounces of water in two 1-quart canteens.
• 100 ounces of water in a hydration bladder.
• Casualty and witness cards.
• Flex cuffs for personnel under custody.
• Night vision equipment (PVS-14/PVS-7).
• Iodine tablets.
• Lensatic compass.
• Flashlight.
• Chemlight.
• First Aid dressing and pouch.
• Canteen Cup.
• Earplugs.
C. Carried in Assault Rucksack:
• MOLLE Assault Rucksack or commercial assault rucksack, with MOLLE attachments.
• 500ml intravenous fluids bag with starter kit.
• 70 ounces of water in a second hydration bladder.
• Two Meals, Ready to Eat (MREs).
• Poncho and/or Bivy Sack.
• Poncho liner.
• Undershirt.
• Spare batteries.
• Two pair of socks.
• Polypropylene or silk long sleeve undershirt.
• M4/M16 Rifle Cleaning Kit.
• Personal hygiene kit.
• Rubber gloves.
• Sling rope with two snap links.
D. Carried in Main Rucksack: (Main rucksacks were rarely taken on operations during
study)
• MOLLE main rucksack with Sleeping Bag Carrier or Large ALICE rucksack.
• Modular Sleeping Bag (one bag per two men).
• Long Polypropylene Underwear of Fleece Jacket and Bibs.
• Two Undershirts.
• Two pairs of socks.
• Cold Weather Gloves.
• Knit/Fleece Cap.
• Additional ammunition.
• Two Meals, Ready to Eat (MREs).
• Sleeping pad.
Special Equipment:
• Lock pick (B).
• Collapsible Riot Baton (B).
• Bolt cutters (C or D).
• Metal detecting wand (C or D).
• 60mm mortar round (C or D).
• Combat Lifesaver Kit (C).
• Personnel Under Custody (PUC) Kit (sand bags, flex cuffs, trash bags, PUC cards, rubber
gloves) (C).
• AT4 Anti-armor Weapon. (C or D).
• SMAW-D Bunker Defeat Weapon. (C or D).
• Hooligan Tool. (C or D).
• Sledgehammer. (C or D).
• Entrenching Tool. (C or D).
• M18 Claymore Mine. (C or D).
• Pole-less Litter. (C or D).
• 200 rounds of 5.56mm linked ammunition for M249 SAW. (C or D).
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Not judging, just saying that a 135 pound rifleman in the 82nd is getting his ass kicked by his load on a regular basis.
Guess how much 135 pounds of lightweight gear weighs?
TR
__________________
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat." - President Theodore Roosevelt, 1910
De Oppresso Liber 01/20/2025
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The Reaper is offline
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08-06-2010, 16:26
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#18
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Asset
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Orlando, Fl
Posts: 5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Utah Bob
From what is this log suspended? 
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Haha well I hold it above my head in a way something a bit like this  . Its an old wrestling workout that I used to do all the time in HS. My purpose for starting this thread was to find out if my stature would in some way disqualify me from becoming a SF soldier just by default. I am not so much concerned with weights or distances as I know that I will be capable of carrying and covering them with several months of training especially since I am already in fairly good shape (I can rock climb 5.8's with a 20lb weight vest on and was hiking 15-25 mile days with a 35-45lb pack on for 29 days during june/july. However, I guess if their is anything to take away from this thread it is that I should try to bulk up to at least 145-150lbs lean mass which shouldn't be that hard given my genetics and enough food. Anyhow, I truly appreciate your input and look forward to exploring the depths of knowledge on this site further.
*JJ_BPK * My intention for that was in no way to be arrogant and if that is the vibe you got from my last post I apologize.
Last edited by Chuckarthy; 08-06-2010 at 16:31.
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Chuckarthy is offline
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08-06-2010, 16:57
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#19
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Castle Rock, CO
Posts: 2,531
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Reaper
Not judging, just saying that a 135 pound rifleman in the 82nd is getting his ass kicked by his load on a regular basis.
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I seem to recall being a little more tired than my larger squaddies back in the day...and after a three or four day exercise, I was pretty well spent..
Quote:
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Guess how much 135 pounds of lightweight gear weighs?
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210 pounds...maybe 250...
And to Teddy's question...how does a 135 pound trooper carry that kind of weight around (okay, I paraphrased )...it takes a lotta wanna...
__________________
""A man must know his destiny. if he does not recognize it, then he is lost. By this I mean, once, twice, or at the very most, three times, fate will reach out and tap a man on the shoulder. if he has the imagination, he will turn around and fate will point out to him what fork in the road he should take, if he has the guts, he will take it.""- GEN George S. Patton
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lksteve is offline
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08-06-2010, 22:47
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#20
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BANNED USER
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 3,751
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chuckarthy
. . . My purpose for starting this thread was to find out if my stature would in some way disqualify me from becoming a SF soldier just by default. . . .
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Do your feet reach the ground? Then you're not to short.
Seriously, how big is your heart? What about your head? If those two are the right proportions you'll be okay.
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Dozer523 is offline
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08-07-2010, 08:08
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#21
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Southern Mo
Posts: 1,541
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I have watched little dudes go like crazy. Have watched guys built like greek statues quit/fail miserably.
As young as you are, I wouldn't worry a lot about the weight. Chow hall eatin' will put some ass on ya'.
Anybody up for some shit-on-a-shingle?
__________________
"And how can man die better than facing fearful odds, for the ashes of his fathers, and the temples of his gods?"
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"One man with courage makes a majority." Andrew Jackson
"Well Mr. Carpetbagger. We got something in this territory called the Missouri boat ride."
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craigepo is offline
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08-07-2010, 10:56
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#22
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Georgetown, SC
Posts: 4,204
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Quote:
Originally Posted by craigepo
I have watched little dudes go like crazy. Have watched guys built like greek statues quit/fail miserably.
As young as you are, I wouldn't worry a lot about the weight. Chow hall eatin' will put some ass on ya'.
Anybody up for some shit-on-a-shingle?
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I was 5'9" and 150 when I went to Camp Mackall. I had a fear that I would be the smallest guy there - because the soldier who had been at Infantry and Airborne with me was 6'3" and 210... looked like John Wayne, and did a great impression, which was a handy skill in 1970 SFTG (I copied his imitation, though I looked nothing like "The Duke"... a couple guys from SFTG still know me as "Duke"!). When I got there, I discovered I was more the norm than the exception. However, we didn't have many guys much smaller than I was....
"Shit-on-a-shingle"! Yum. Though it didn't measure up to my mom's "chipped beef on toast" - I soon came to love the Army version, as I did most "Army chow." It was often derided, and I must admit the USAF seemed to eat better regularly. However, on the whole it was ,IMHO, usually pretty good, sometimes very good, and always plentiful.
"Chow down, hogs!"
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"I took a different route from most and came into Special Forces..." - Col. Nick Rowe
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ZonieDiver is offline
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08-07-2010, 11:08
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#23
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Area Commander
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Clay House Stuttgart, Germany
Posts: 2,675
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Sometimes there are advantages to being slight of build.
The tunnel rats that served during the the Viet Nam war are a fine example.
Last edited by mojaveman; 08-07-2010 at 18:33.
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mojaveman is offline
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08-07-2010, 13:01
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#24
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Guerrilla
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Superior's Lakeside.
Posts: 125
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Pricleess advice...
Quote:
Do your feet reach the ground? Then you're not to short.
Seriously, how big is your heart? What about your head? If those two are the right proportions you'll be okay.
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Very sound advice for so many other applications in life. That is a gem Dozer! 
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theis223 is offline
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08-07-2010, 17:19
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#25
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: 11 miles from Dove Creek, Colorady
Posts: 3,924
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mojaveman
Sometimes there are advantages to being slight of build.
The tunnel rats that served during the the Viet Nam war are a fine example.
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Well..when it came to tunnels I always thought that a fella about 6'4" and 250 had the advantage.
He couldn't fit in 'em.
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"...But if it be a sin to covet honour,
I am the most offending soul alive."
Shakespeare - Henry V
Lazy Bob Ranch
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Utah Bob is offline
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08-07-2010, 17:21
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#26
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: 11 miles from Dove Creek, Colorady
Posts: 3,924
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Only disadvantage to being short was that I couldn't take as long strides with snowshoes and fell behind the team or (usually) had to break trail.
__________________
"...But if it be a sin to covet honour,
I am the most offending soul alive."
Shakespeare - Henry V
Lazy Bob Ranch
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Utah Bob is offline
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08-07-2010, 17:43
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#27
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Nashville
Posts: 956
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Size does matter.
Height and weight certainly have some bearing on being SF in the minds of some.
This can be measured and photographed , but the real measure is measured by trial.
This is the measure of the Heart and will. No physical sizing will help determine this result. Blitzzz
__________________
The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government.
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To compel a man to subsidize with his taxes the propagation of ideas which he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.
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Last edited by Blitzzz (RIP); 08-08-2010 at 06:56.
Reason: Spelling.
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Blitzzz (RIP) is offline
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08-07-2010, 18:46
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#28
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Occupied America....
Posts: 4,740
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Utah Bob
Only disadvantage to being short was that I couldn't take as long strides with snowshoes and fell behind the team or (usually) had to break trail.
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Had some studs out in Yuma who had issue with the distance between the bottom of the pack tray and the ground while they were standing up. (This is prior to exit for you guys about to make some smart-alecky remark  ). Sometimes there isn't a lot of rucksack that fits between there.
Course, once you leave the ramp, none of that really matters....athough you could find yourself lacking a high quality rudder when you need one the most.
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"There are more instances of the abridgment of freedom of the people by gradual and silent encroachments of those in power than by violent and sudden usurpations"
James Madison
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Ret10Echo is offline
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08-07-2010, 22:52
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#29
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Orange, Ca.
Posts: 4,950
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We had a medic in 46th Co that was 5'2"-5'3". It wasn't a problem until we had a jump out of a UH-1H. He was in the front spot, sitting on the edge of the cabin but his feet didn't reach the skid. When he pushed himself out, he didn't clear the skid and got hung up by the saddle on his harness. 1500' in the air, hanging upside down by his ass...
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mark46th is offline
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08-08-2010, 01:12
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#30
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Wilson,NC
Posts: 1,506
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blitzzz
Height and weight certainly have some bearing on being SF in the minds of some.
This can be measured and photographed , but the real measure is measured by trial.
This is the measure of the Heart and will. No physical sizing will hep determine this result. Blitzzz
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I always found it kind of amusing when some of the Arnold Jr.'s couldn't pass the PT test, while the little skinny guys had no problems.
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"Solitude is strength; to depend on the presence of the crowd is weakness. The man who needs a mob to nerve him is much more alone than he imagines."
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R.D. Winters
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rdret1 is offline
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