05-14-2010, 06:36
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#16
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Auxiliary
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 97
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Short AR
Kgoerz, Did you end up getting the pistol variant from Wes and Paul? If so, how do you like it now?
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Boomer-61 is offline
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05-15-2010, 06:02
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#17
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: NC for now
Posts: 2,418
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We ended up going with the Noveske 7.5". They worked great. Then they disbanded the Team.
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Sounds like a s#*t sandwhich, but I'll fight anyone, I'm in.
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kgoerz is offline
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05-21-2010, 01:59
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#18
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Asset
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Ft. Campbell/ Ft. Bragg
Posts: 38
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the DPMS Kitty is a decent set up so I hear. It is 7inch as well.
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People hang on his every word, even the prepositions. He could disarm you with his looks... or his hands, either way. He can speak French in Russian. He is the most interesting man in the world. |
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Koa18B is offline
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05-21-2010, 07:51
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#19
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Guerrilla
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Chicago
Posts: 126
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Quote:
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the DPMS Kitty is a decent set up so I hear. It is 7inch as well.
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Ive trained with the US Marshals SOG a few times and their entry guys were running the DPMS kitty. They seemed to work just fine, I don't recall a single hiccup across the line.
I do remember one of the guys putting a silencer on his gun and it ran through a 30 mag in what seemed like a second and a half. It really amped up the cyclic rate.
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MeC86 is offline
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05-23-2010, 00:49
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#20
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Guerrilla
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Pacific Northwest
Posts: 356
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MeC86
I do remember one of the guys putting a silencer on his gun and it ran through a 30 mag in what seemed like a second and a half. It really amped up the cyclic rate.
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How/why? Any armchair physicists in the audience, feel free to jump in.
per
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perdurabo is offline
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05-23-2010, 03:01
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#21
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Asset
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 0
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Methinks it is because of the increased back-pressure of some suppressor designs. Increased number of RPM is also observed in some SMGs when running a can. Heard on uzi.com that it is the design of the can (ie different cans increase back-pressure to different levels and hence the RPM)
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pro.0s is offline
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05-23-2010, 06:36
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#22
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Free Pineland
Posts: 24,825
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pro.0s
Methinks it is because of the increased back-pressure of some suppressor designs. Increased number of RPM is also observed in some SMGs when running a can. Heard on uzi.com that it is the design of the can (ie different cans increase back-pressure to different levels and hence the RPM)
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pro:
There is nothing in your brief intro or nonexistent profile to indicate that you have any personal expertise with SBRs, automatic weapons, or suppressors.
We do not need unsubstantiated comments from other web sites regurgitated by someone with no known personal experience.
Either lay out your personal experience in your profile and intro, or if you have none, refrain from posting on these threads.
Thanks for your cooperation.
TR
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"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat." - President Theodore Roosevelt, 1910
De Oppresso Liber 01/20/2025
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The Reaper is offline
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05-25-2010, 07:55
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#23
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Guerrilla
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Wisconsin BCM territory
Posts: 152
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The most common side effects encountered when shooting suppressed (especially with the M16/M4) is increased back pressure as well as an increase in the cyclic rate. This is due to the fact that the gases are being "retarded' and diverted by the baffles. You will also see a drop in the muzzle velocity as well.
This is why it may also be necessary to change buffers when shooting suppressed. For example, my 11.5" would cycle 100% using an H2 buffer, but I would not get 100% magazine lockback everytime. Once I went to an H3 buffer the problem was solved.
The baffles work by slowing down and traping the gases before they leave the barrel as well as allowing it to cool.
Quote:
Originally Posted by perdurabo
How/why? Any armchair physicists in the audience, feel free to jump in.
per
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Iraqgunz is offline
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05-31-2010, 15:49
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#24
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Asset
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 0
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apologies
Sorry, TR. thought he asked for a physicist (admittedly haven't graduated yet). I'll keep my mouth shut and fingers off the keyboard.
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pro.0s is offline
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05-31-2010, 22:23
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#25
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Free Pineland
Posts: 24,825
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pro.0s
Sorry, TR. thought he asked for a physicist (admittedly haven't graduated yet). I'll keep my mouth shut and fingers off the keyboard.
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No worries, just stay in your area of expertise, after you explain what they are.
GTG.
TR
__________________
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat." - President Theodore Roosevelt, 1910
De Oppresso Liber 01/20/2025
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The Reaper is offline
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06-01-2010, 08:28
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#26
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Guerrilla
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Finland
Posts: 400
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iraqgunz
The most common side effects encountered when shooting suppressed (especially with the M16/M4) is increased back pressure as well as an increase in the cyclic rate. This is due to the fact that the gases are being "retarded' and diverted by the baffles. You will also see a drop in the muzzle velocity as well.
This is why it may also be necessary to change buffers when shooting suppressed. For example, my 11.5" would cycle 100% using an H2 buffer, but I would not get 100% magazine lockback everytime. Once I went to an H3 buffer the problem was solved.
The baffles work by slowing down and traping the gases before they leave the barrel as well as allowing it to cool.
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I would say your post is mostly correct, but I must disagree with the mention of a lower MV. Where have you seen or tested this?
If there is a change, it is usually a slight increase.
Whilst the post is still about suppressors, a quick photo from a test shooting / zeroing session today. Range 100 meters with Lapua 167 gr Scenar 
Best Regards!
Tuukka Jokinen
Ase Utra sound suppressors
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RECON - Always a step ahead
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Tuukka is offline
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06-01-2010, 12:50
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#27
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Guerrilla
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Wisconsin BCM territory
Posts: 152
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Tuuka,
I remember seeing this data, just can't remember where. I personally do not have access to a chrono so I can validate it. I would assume that since the gases are being diverted it would slow down the bullet as it exits the barrel.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tuukka
I would say your post is mostly correct, but I must disagree with the mention of a lower MV. Where have you seen or tested this?
If there is a change, it is usually a slight increase.
Whilst the post is still about suppressors, a quick photo from a test shooting / zeroing session today. Range 100 meters with Lapua 167 gr Scenar
Best Regards!
Tuukka Jokinen
Ase Utra sound suppressors |
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Iraqgunz is offline
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06-01-2010, 13:11
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#28
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Guerrilla
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Finland
Posts: 400
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Iraqgunz
Tuuka,
I remember seeing this data, just can't remember where. I personally do not have access to a chrono so I can validate it. I would assume that since the gases are being diverted it would slow down the bullet as it exits the barrel.
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As I said, usually the opposite will happen, a slight increase.
As an example, here is a link to data from an extensive suppressor test organized by the Finnish gun magazine, Kaliberi, in the fall of 2007;
http://www.aseutra.fi/english/Kalibe...sults_2007.JPG
Best Regards!
Tuukka Jokinen
Ase Utra sound suppressors
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RECON - Always a step ahead
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Tuukka is offline
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06-01-2010, 23:19
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#29
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Boise area, ID
Posts: 319
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Firing with a can produces a phenomenon that I've heard called freebore boost. So yes it boosts MV not lowers it. And it's not too consistent in my experience, unfortunately.
A can does increase the amount of blowback through the bore, this raises carrier velocity significantly, surprisingly, by pushing the empty case while still held in the bolt face.
IG, If the increasing numbers means a heavier buffer, and an H3 locked back, I would say that with the H2 buffer your cycle times were too fast for the bolt stop. If you check the rim of an empty case, you would probably notice a part where it looks like the extractor tried to rip the rim off. This will be less with the heavier buffer.
Last edited by Justinmd; 06-01-2010 at 23:22.
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