Two SF questions

[FILO]

Originally Posted by ArtR

There were two Jump School and Jumpmaster classes that I know of that were held by the 10th Grp while I was assigned there. I left in 1958 so I can't honestly say if the courses continued into the 60's or not.

Yes, graduate of 1/10 jumpmaster school in Nov 1984 at Tolz. The team running the school had Mark O'Neil as TL and CWO Mims. IIRC, Mims was one of the first SF WOs.

[lksteve]

Originally Posted by FILO

Yes, graduate of 1/10 jumpmaster school in Nov 1984 at Tolz. The team running the school had Mark O'Neil as TL and CWO Mims. IIRC, Mims was one of the first SF WOs.

The chief had to be...when I left Toelz in December of 1983, there were none there...I don't know if there were any in the pipeline, either...and Mark was probably one of the last LT detachment XOs...

[Paste Eater]

Originally Posted by Retired W4

After researching two subjects close to me, I now must roll the dice and post the questions here. I suspect the reason I haven't found my answers yet is because the info may still be classified. If that is the case feel free to slap the crap out of me and close the thread. I will understand.

1. I am looking for information of SF involvement in activities leading up to the "Cambodian Campaign" very early in 1970. John Shaw's book devotes one sentence to SF.

2. One of those "crazy uncles" on my wife's side tells of initial airborne training in Germany (not Ft. Benning) in 1960/1961 prior to being sent to Laos with SF. Could this be true?

Ok, let the evisceration begin.

My Grandfather went to jump school in BT, Germany in 1955/56ish. 10th Grp

[scmarines9303]

Are soldiers not SF qualified allowed in your units? In other words do they allow soldiers who are too old now to qual for SF to be part of the units in other capacities?

For example, I shoot expert, have an admn, signal, infantry and MP mos! But I am also 39 years old but look nowhere close to that age. Just want to do my part!!

[JumpinJoe1010]

Originally Posted by scmarines9303

Are soldiers not SF qualified allowed in your units? In other words do they allow soldiers who are too old now to qual for SF to be part of the units in other capacities?

For example, I shoot expert, have an admn, signal, infantry and MP mos! But I am also 39 years old but look nowhere close to that age. Just want to do my part!!

[SF_BHT]

Originally Posted by scmarines9303

Are soldiers not SF qualified allowed in your units? In other words do they allow soldiers who are too old now to qual for SF to be part of the units in other capacities?

For example, I shoot expert, have an admn, signal, infantry and MP mos! But I am also 39 years old but look nowhere close to that age. Just want to do my part!!

TS/TR/Razor Tag your it.

[Razor]

I think you'd be hard pressed to find any battalion-sized unit the the US military that doesn't have at least two different MOSs assigned to it (think support requirements). Try a search on 'support mos' and see what happens.

[mark46th]

W4- You might want to read Don Valentine's writings on White Star. He was one of the early ones in White Star and may have known your uncle, if he really was there. His website is donvalentine.com. If you have time, read his writings about his army career. Pretty funny guy...

[skydoc60A5G]

http://www.don-valentine.com/Don-index.htm

[mark46th]

Thanks, Sky Doc...

[skydoc60A5G]

ORGANZIATION (June 1960):

8th Div Abn School Wiesbaden AB

In anticipation of the arrival of the 504th and 505th Abn Infs, the Airborne School was assigned to the 8th Division in the later part of 1958. At that time the cadre consisted of personnel who originally taught at the now deactivated 11th Abn Div Jump School. As the instructors from the 11th Abn began rotating, they were replaced by personnel from the 504th and 505th, many of whom had taught at the 82d, 101st, or Fort Benning Jump Schools. With this blending of experience, the 8th Inf Div Airborne School has one of the finest staffs of airborne instructors in the world.

The majority of the 1400 students who have been graduated from the school since its inception have attended only one of the seven courses taught at the school.

Airborne units assigned to the 8th Infantry Division in the PENTOMIC configuration (1958-1963):

UNIT DESIGNATION
STATION COMMENTS
1st ABN BG, 504th Inf Lee Bks, Mainz [1] [3]
1st ABN BG, 505th Inf Lee Bks, Mainz [2]

[1] The unit was redesignated as the 1st Airborne Battle Group, 504th Infantry on 1 September 1957. On 12 December 1958, the 1/504 became part of the 8th Infantry Division and was based at Lee Barracks, in Mainz-Gonsenheim, Germany. On 1 April 1963, the battalion was relieved from assignment to the 8th Inf Div and assigned to the 82nd ABN Div.
[2] Co A, 505th Abn Inf was reorganized and redesignated as the 1st Airborne Battle Group, 505th Infantry on 1 September 1957. On 15 January 1959, the 1/505 became a part of the 8th Infantry Division and was based at Lee Barracks, in Mainz-Gonsenheim, Germany. On 1 April 1963, the battalion was relieved from assignment to the 8th Inf Div and assigned to the 82nd ABN Div.
[3] It appears that some or all airborne units moved to Rhein Kaserne in Biebrich (Wiesbaden) at some point, maybe during the Berlin Crisis, 1961.

Airborne units assigned to the 8th Infantry Division in the ROAD configuration (1963-1973):

UNIT DESIGNATION
STATION COMMENTS
HHC, 1st ABN/Mech Brigade Lee Bks, Mainz
1st ABN/Mech Bn, 509th Inf Lee Bks, Mainz [1]
2nd ABN/Mech Bn, 509th Inf Lee Bks, Mainz [2]

[1] On 27 March 1963, Co A, 509th Parachute Infantry Battalion was redesignated as HHC, 1st Bn, 509th Inf and assigned to the 8th Inf Div (organic elements concurrently constituted). The Battalion was activated on 1 April 1963 in Germany.
[2] On 27 March 1963, Co B, 509th Parachute Infantry Battalion was redesignated as HHC, 2nd Bn, 509th Inf and assigned to the 8th Inf Div (organic elements concurrently constituted). The Battalion was activated on 1 April 1963 in Germany.

In 1973, the existing 1st and 2nd Battalions of the 509th Infantry were replaced by two mechanized infantry battalions (2d Bn, 28th Inf and 2d Bn, 87th Inf) which brought the 8th Infantry Division to fully mechanized status and provided it with the enhanced cability to defend Central Europe, its primary task. To provide greater mobility to the Mediterranean area, the 1st Battalion of the 509th Infantry (ABCT) was assigned to Vicenza, Italy.

[Alvar]

[QUOTE=Retired W4;206831]After researching two subjects close to me, I now must roll the dice and post the questions here. I suspect the reason I haven't found my answers yet is because the info may still be classified. If that is the case feel free to slap the crap out of me and close the thread. I will understand.

1. I am looking for information of SF involvement in activities leading up to the "Cambodian Campaign" very early in 1970. John Shaw's book devotes one sentence to SF.

2. With all respects sir, i have some info that could hanser your question on Lao secret wars 1961, and the Hmong sbgect, I have some photos that testify, yes in Oct. 61. 7th sf army personel where sent to Lao in operation White Star. the colection of material is so valuable on this subject. I'd love to sher some fo this knoledge with you fellers.