On the Run

[Quietus]

I'm going to try and answer TR's question by staying real narrowly within the boundary of that 45lb BoB, just bringing out a few carried items to discuss why they are carried. Also grabbed, is a belt/suspenders rig.

For that travel, much in my AO might be able to be done in daylight and still avoid detection (drones, probably not, but there's not much call for them here just now.) Travel assumption though, is to lie up during daylight and travel at night. I carry poncho and cord, liner, casualty blanket, field jacket liner, a neck gaiter and polypro LJs always. A light mesh 3' x 6' veil is nice to keep the flies away from nap time, and it does good to make the day hide harder to see.

For a trip that far, I'd prefer a state aero chart. My map provides the landmarks that a person is going to see, plus a sense of what the other folks are looking at. It's showing of relief and of drainages is not bad, for a single map that covers much territory. For other looking around, Steiner 8x30 M&M binos, they are good enough and light enough. And a Silva Ranger compass (what an 11C instructor once told me was a nice "throw-away" compass.)

I'd take a small water filtration pump to help out the two (hopefully, with 5 min notice, full) British 1L water bottles and an empty '67 vintage USGI 2 qt bladder (the old ones are real soft and collapse better than the new ones do.)

A taped-up pack of three AAA cells for my headlamp.

I'd probably be eating a lot of ibuprofin, and would want to have something stronger for pain and muscle cramping. 5-hr energy bottles work pretty well for me.

My bag doesn't provide cooking facilities beyond a canteen cup and hexy stove. Bullion, tea, and a couple Ramens might help morale and stave cravings for what real food remains in the bag. A Bic lighter, much as I dislike them, helps to light outdated farmer's matches, and to relight their burnt stumps.

The loadout would be the above carried in the BoB and on belt/suspenders. The belt doesn't weigh too much: two 9mm pistol mags; two 5.56mm rifle mags;Molle II waistpack with one water bottle, matches, Steiners, compass, Clif bars, socks/foot powder; and a box of .22LR mmo inside; Ek Bowie, Glock G17; and a first aid pouch.

Earlier posts have made me realize that pot hunting would probably be part of the trip. So, an old Ruger Mk1 in an old tanker holster would be a good thing.

I'd probably be carrying a 16" AR with a light on it. Two mags on the belt, and three mags and a bandoleer of 120 rounds in the pack.

I'd be happy enough to take my M1 carbine with four spare 15-rd mags. Only thing is, resupply if required, would not be like the domino theory of weapons acquisition. At the end of the 100-mile trip, things would be no cheerier, unless I'd pre-positioned that gun's ammunition.

[BryanK]

Originally Posted by Old Dog New Trick

Reading this thread and the responses has prompted another question in my mind. Not to take from TR's podium too much, but -

How have you guys chosen to load bearing all this equipment? Lets take for instance you have a 45Lb B-O-B (average 3-day pack), 15-20Lbs of weapons (some of you have another 20Lbs of ammo), and then there are some specific "must haves" that are either climate or geographical in nature...

Describe how you load out on your person each and every piece of equipment deemed important enough (or by importance to the success of your endeavor) to get you from point "A" to point "Z" being 100-miles away?

Be specific, and think about what you can and cannot afford to jettison should you have to to evade capture or get in an extended fight where time or failure means game over. Be very specific about how and where you will carry the weapons you have chosen (including edged) and sufficient ammo for each type.

This is a mental exercise whereas each piece of your "kit" is assembled and carried in such a way that if you are forced to run and hide or out run you can dump the unnecessary comfort items and continue with the mission in the best possible outcome.

My set up excluding what my wife would be carrying (already posted earlier in the thread) if we chose to bug instead of stand our ground. I modified my gear from my original post a bit. Also, each garment will be doubled as to accommodate the wife as well. The 700 will be cross-slung at a 45 degree angle on my back with the .22 at the ready, but it has a sling as well. Here it goes:

Medium ALICE ruck main compartment from bottom to top:

1pr BDU bottoms (rolled)
1 Fleece top (rolled)
2pr Socks
2pr Underoos
1ea Mini maglite
1ea Camping pot
1ea Loaf of bread
2ea 6 pack(s) of crackers
1 ea Small bag of Fritos

In that little pouch toward the top of the pack:

2ea MRE's
1ea Small first aid kit
1ea Survival FM

Medium ALICE ruck pockets:

Left pocket: My roll of 550 cord (unsure of measurement but there is a lot of it), 6 spare batteries for Surfire light and an 8 pack of AA batteries.

Center pocket: 2 flattened (no tube) rolls of TP.

Right pocket: 1ea roll of OD green 100mph tape, 1 8 pack of AAA batteries, and an extra fishing bag (explained below under "worn")

Outside of ALICE ruck:

E-tool with pouch, 1 empty two quart canteen with pouch, 2ea woobies, and 2ea ponchos in separate dump pouches affixed to the sides of the ruck above the canteen and e-tool pouches.

LBE (I have the same thing as the picture below with a butt pack):

Right magazine pockets: 4ea 10 round magazines of CCI .22 ammo on top pocket; 10ea rounds of .308 in plastic sleeve, and 20ea rounds of super colibri in this styrofoam pouch thing I made in bottom pocket.

Left magazine pockets: 10 rounds of .308 in plastic sleeve it came in

Right grenade pouch: 60 rounds of CCI .22

Left grenade pouch: 80 rounds of colibiri's

Butt pack: First aid kit, bug juice, 2pr socks, 1ea MRE guts.

Pistol belt: 1ea 1qt canteen with cup and pouch, M9 holster w/ M9, and my fixed blade with pouch.

Worn:

Head: Ball cap and Petzl headlamp when needed.

Torso: Camelback, and weather dependent clothing.

Left hip, exterior: Gerber multi-tool and cell phone w/pouches for both.

Left cargo pocket: Fishing bag (2 bobbers, several split-shot sinkers, a pack of #8 & #2 snelled hooks, stringer, 2 bucktail, and 2 grub lures).

Right cargo pocket: Smartbook (just kidding)

Left pocket: Probably a half a pack of cigarettes, and keys.

Right pocket: Bic lighter, and my folder clip slipped over the top lining, knife inside pocket.

Right, Back pocket: Wallet.

Drop leg rig, left side: 2 double mag pouch for 9mm ammo (total of 60rounds between 3 pouched up mags and 15 loaded in pistol).

I'm sure I left something out, but this is what I came up with for now.

[The Reaper]

Looks like we are moving from the weapons to the ruck and load contents.

IRT ODNT's question, some of you have the idea of multiple layers of gear, but not exactly what goes in them. We have discussed this before, but for the benefit of the latecomers, let's review.

There are three primary layers or "lines" of gear.

Your first line is what you have on you. This would be in your pockets or attached to your pants belt. This layer would include your clothes, boots, hat, belt, primary firemaking gear, some signaling items in your pockets, a knife and/or multitool, some cordage, a flashlight, microlight, or headlamp, a pocket survival kit, your map, compass, a pocket first aid kit, EDC litter, pistol (if worn on your pants), pistol ammo pouches, maybe a power bar or some hard candies, etc. Possibly some water purification tabs. Basically, you can survive at a very reduced level with your first line. Most people would try and carry at least one weapon on their first line. I have used first line gear ranging from pocket items and a belt with multitool to a war belt with suspenders, a dump pouch, larger knife and pistol, spare ammo, flashlight, etc.

Your second line gear is generally your fighting load consisting of your weapon and LCE or vest, to include your body armor and items carried on your LCE like ammo, a trauma kit, binos, a large knife, a handheld radio in a pouch, water, etc. You might drop your second line while in camp, unfasten it for water ops, or other activities where you were relatively secure. Try to have enough stuff here that you could, along with your first line, make it to your objective without the ruck.

Finally, your third line loadout would consist of your sustainment gear, with your ruck, and its contents. This contains your shelter items, food, additional water, spare batteries, etc. Your third line would likely be dropped for actual combat requiring quick movement.

You need to figure out what you absolutely have to carry to survive, and build your first line around carrying that.

Then what you need to fight effectively, and how to carry it for your second line.

Everything else goes in your ruck as third line gear.

You guys have the concept, but might want to tune it a bit before jocking up and moving out.

Don't forget that there is a weight limit. Frankly, if you are carrying more than 1/3 of your body weight, unless you do that for a living, you are a pack mule and are tactically ineffective.

Try putting everything on your list on you or in your ruck and hit the woods with it for a few hours or perhaps overnight. You might wind up making a big pile of it on the floor and figure if you didn't take it out of the pack for an overnighter, are you really going to need it when you are on the run?

Slingshots are handy. But a survival situation is no time to be learning how to use one or to count on it to put food in the pot.

A pistol is a close range back-up weapon. I would not be storing my spare pistol mags in a butt pack. You might not live to regret that. Same for putting rifle mags in pockets. Put them on your rig and practice tac reloads and speed reloads. If you want to hide them, wear another garment over them.

If it were wet or winter weather, a large overcoat, raincoat, or greatcoat (large enough to wear over your second line and maybe your pack) might be a good thing to grab and throw on when you are on the way out. Less conspicuous than a poncho.

Glad to see everyone remembered the TP. With the potential for bad water and questionable food, you could use a lot of it quickly. And it beats the hell out of leaves. If you are on an MRE diet, you might find the opposite problem, but thankfully, each MRE has its own TP supply. If you have a few extras, or find some accessory packs, take several TP packs and put them in a sealed Zip-Loc bag to keep them dry.

Leg holsters look cool, but unless you wear one every day, I doubt that you are going to be making much distance before you pull it off and chuck it.

One thing to remember about rucks is that the load usually grows to fill the space available. A big ruck may have room for things you find along the way, but it weighs more and you will likely find things to fill it.

Good to see people are thinking about their loads and what to bring, as well as what to leave behind.

TR

[Old Dog New Trick]

Originally Posted by The Reaper

Looks like we are moving from the weapons to the ruck and load contents.

IRT ODNT's question, some of you have the idea of multiple layers of gear, but not exactly what goes in them. We have discussed this before, but for the benefit of the latecomers, let's review.

There are three primary layers or "lines" of gear.

Your first line is what you have on you. This would be in your pockets or attached to your pants belt. This layer would include your clothes, boots, hat, belt, primary firemaking gear, some signaling items in your pockets, a knife and/or multitool, some cordage, a flashlight, microlight, or headlamp, a pocket survival kit, your map, compass, a pocket first aid kit, EDC litter, pistol (if worn on your pants), pistol ammo pouches, maybe a power bar or some hard candies, etc. Possibly some water purification tabs. Basically, you can survive at a very reduced level with your first line. Most people would try and carry at least one weapon on their first line. I have used first line gear ranging from pocket items and a belt with multitool to a war belt with suspenders, a dump pouch, larger knife and pistol, spare ammo, flashlight, etc.

Your second line gear is generally your fighting load consisting of your weapon and LCE or vest, to include your body armor and items carried on your LCE like ammo, a trauma kit, binos, a large knife, a handheld radio in a pouch, water, etc. You might drop your second line while in camp, unfasten it for water ops, or other activities where you were relatively secure. Try to have enough stuff here that you could, along with your first line, make it to your objective without the ruck.

Finally, your third line loadout would consist of your sustainment gear, with your ruck, and its contents. This contains your shelter items, food, additional water, spare batteries, etc. Your third line would likely be dropped for actual combat requiring quick movement.

You need to figure out what you absolutely have to carry to survive, and build your first line around carrying that.

Then what you need to fight effectively, and how to carry it for your second line.

Everything else goes in your ruck as third line gear.

You guys have the concept, but might want to tune it a bit before jocking up and moving out.

TR

TR nails it!

This is (was) the purpose of my question. For you guys to think about where and how you carry the items and weapons most needed to successfully meet the demands of the exercise. Think of it this way: you have to lose your pants, shirt and footwear to become hopelessly underprepared to continue to evade and make it to your designated rendezvous.

A good knife, fire starter, and 10' of para cord with its guts will get you far. A good pistol will make taking what you need that much easier...

Thinking about TR's exercise requirements (5-minutes to get out, and 100-miles distance to cover) and the real possibility that me and/or my family may be in a situation where E&Eing from my strongest defensive position is necessary. I would begin to start thinking about caching needed items and survival tools outside my home, either in ground, or lockers with public access (e.g., bus, train, airport, bowling center, etc... coin operated lockers) that I can move to within a half day to first day's time. Obviously you may not want to store weapons in these but everything else not traceable to you is fair game. I would also think placing these kits in multiple directions or over a greater distance since I can't pre game my initial direction to safe passage...just food for thought.

[Barbarian]

Originally Posted by TR

And it beats the hell out of leaves.

CONCUR. One just doesn't understand how much better it is to have TP, until you've gone without.

1st Line:
Map & Compass
Canteen & cup
Mini Survival Kit
DMT Diafold Sharpener
1/4 bar of soap
1/2 a Toothbrush
TP
Folding Knife
Fixed Blade
Extra Pair Socks
Leatherman Wave
Surefire E2D
Petzl Tikka 2 Headlamp
Glock 17 & 1 extra mag
S&W MP15 (AR)

2nd Line/LBV:
4 Pmags
2 Pistol Mags
Trauma Pouch
canteen
SOF-T W Tourniquet

3rd Line/Ruck:
Poncho
Woobie
Issue Goretex Bivy Shell (woodland camo)
Hammock
Torso-length Closed Cell Foam Pad
Small Folding Trowel
Small Aid Kit
Foot Powder & Extra Moleskin
Extra Pair Socks
Change of Clothes
Extra Bic Lighter
80' Paracord
1 Ten-Serving Can of Mountain House Freeze-Dried Food.
1 Film Bottle of Salt
3' Gorilla Tape
Extra Batteries
Camelback Reservoir

[grog18b]

Originally Posted by The Reaper

Another scenario to play with.

You are at home and have five minutes notice that you are about to be raided by a vastly superior force. You need to execute your personal E&E plan.

The streets and roads are already covered for vehicle movement, so you will have to move out on foot to a safe area 100 miles away.

You already have a bug out bag prepared with 45 pounds of food, water, shelter, med gear, survival tools, etc. We can discuss the contents of the bag if you like.

You need to hit the woods on foot and may need to harvest game, defend yourself against predators, and engage small hostile teams. Try not to beat this scenario to death.

Your safe is open and you may grab as many weapons, mags, and as much ammo as you wish to carry.

What do you take and why?

TR

With the above scenario, personally, I would stay put and walk the family to the "hide" site, or E+E to a close friend's residence. If you have adequate home security, with a very good hide, you and your family can survive for at least a month without breaking the seal (so to speak...). This force that is raiding you... I suppose they are 3-11 or 7-3 government type shift workers, so them staying at my house looking for me for days or months... I doubt it. I'd last longer as I have all the Star Trek series on DVD, so I could stay in my recliner, in the hide, for a month straight, without need for much more than an occasional back rub and some steaks on the portable grill. Come out now and again to kill off a small cow or deer, and back to the hide. With a secure hide site, you have the advantage of a large, pre-planned and placed weapon, ammo, and supply source. Also, you are not expending energy walking about, risking injury and detection by this force. You determine when you come out, and you place your "hide" or enable it so you can monitor it from your location. Force goes, you sleep in your own bed. Force stays, you sleep in the hide.

Personally, I have a wife, and 9 year old daughter I'd have to E+E with, and there is no way in hell I would be able to support the two of them, with all their electronic and bathroom needs, let alone how much those two eat... I'd end up shooting myself. So, E+E for some of us, is a thing of the past. But, if I did E+E, I guess for weapon, I'd need my 357 with one round.

Perhaps I'd take more, depending on how I felt. The wife and daughter can't hump for shit, let alone carry anything while doing it. I, on the other hand, am a pack mule. Always have been, that's why I have a bad back. 100 miles? We did more than that in Benning in a week.... Hell yes, back in the 80s perhaps, with two canteens an AR and 6 mags and a pair of jungle boots... I could go anywhere, and do anything. Maybe in the 90s, but now? Once my pain patch starts to wear off and the back acts up, I am one mean caveman... but I do have a farm, with plenty of food on it, so I might have an advantage. Fruit and nut trees, water source, land to put a nice hide site in and on...

... If your hide has access to transportation routes, clean air, secure commo, power, food and a water source, you could easily maintain yourself and your family's needs for a month or possibly more. Longer, you might need a "support network" such as friends, family, and other Republicans. I have a retired co-worker with plenty of weapons and ammo, as well as food and another "hide" just a mile from me as the crow flies... so if one hide is compromised, you pack up and move to another. Not that we have thought this out over a few beers or anything... It's good to have close friends. They mean support, so if you live somewhere and need to E+E... just something to keep in mind. GROG

I guess us FOGs look at E+E in an entirely different light.

[PSM]

Originally Posted by Old Dog New Trick

<snip>...lockers with public access (e.g., bus, train, airport, bowling center, etc... coin operated lockers) that I can move to within a half day to first day's time.

Do those even exist nowadays? I know that the airport lockers disappeared about 30 years ago. Even then the rental period was only a few days. Allowing that they do, a catastrophic event like an earthquake or Zombie attack may leave them inaccessible. The same may be true if you pre-positioned stuff in self-storage units. In the end, I think, you are going to be humping what you've got in your closet.

That said, we have two high clearance, 4WD, vehicles, plus a trailer that is also high clearance and follows obediently, that we can use to put many miles between us and the bad guys. Yes, they leave a trail, but so do those who are evading on foot. The question is: How good are the trackers?

ETA: We also carry a recovery kit that includes a puncher-repair plug gun.

Pat

[Old Dog New Trick]

Originally Posted by PSM

Do those even exist nowadays? I know that the airport lockers disappeared about 30 years ago. Even then the rental period was only a few days. Allowing that they do, a catastrophic event like an earthquake or Zombie attack may leave them inaccessible. The same may be true if you pre-positioned stuff in self-storage units. In the end, I think, you are going to be humping what you've got in your closet.


Pat

I'd say they are area specific, and more than likely, yes, short time use: You'd have to feed the machine. A lot of airports removed them after 9/11/01 but some have reinstalled new ones that are credit card activated (which has its drawbacks) but still lower off the tread mill places like a bowling ally or health club would still have personal lockers. If you are that wanted by the wrong folks...a membership may be the least of your problems.

I like the idea of adding self-storage units, especially if you have someone not associated with your name as the owner, but has you named on the local paperwork for access... A town or two away you could have a bike or quad just sitting there ready to go...

I'm not a "prepper" just thinking outside-the-box if I had to leave my house in a hurry. Where to go with just a BoB and some guns is only the beginning...

[mugwump]

My bugout location is 104-121 miles away by foot, depending upon route. I've biked the route but never walked it. I definitely hope I have the foresight to be driving there--my knees are shot-- but if I miscalculate and have to walk I intend to use a mountain bike rigged Ho Chi Minh-style to carry the bit of stuff I have here at my residence. I have 99% prepositioned but would still want to move 3 carbines, 3 pistols, coupla cases of ammo, food/clothing/tent/sleeping bag/sundries necessary for the trip, innertubes/pump and tools. If the heavy items are slung low under the crrossbar and bungied so they don't swing the load is quite stable and manageable. I can easily get 200 pounds of gear on the bike this way. A one-wheel trekking cart with padded hip belt for pulling the load is another option but the bike is attractive to me because I can dump the gear and boogie if I have to.

I takes me a minimum of 2-3 hours to get rigged to move this way. Four-six hours is better for fine-tuning the balance. If I had only 5 mins I would have a BOB, a pistol, boots-where-are-my-effing-boots!? and maybe season-appropriate clothing.

If there is more than a couple of inches of snow then the plan is out the window. It would have to be a pretty significant event to drive me out of my primary residence on foot in winter. If I have to, i have snowshoes and have done winter camping but I'd be moving without weapons and ammo in exchange for food and fuel. Well, maybe an H&R .22 wheelgun to try to pot a bunny and for show but I'd probably rather have it's weight in gorp at some point of the trip.

[mdpatterson]

Thank you TR for posting threads like this. Sharing your knowledge and making us think is much appreciated. This thread has made me rethink many things. I am in no short supply of weapons or ammo, but live in a very populated area (Phoenix). Based on this fact alone, I think my best chances for survival would be a team effort. I know there are many members (QP's and guests) living in close proximity to me, and would enjoy the opportunity to network a bit with any like minded individuals. While I don't have the knowledge or skill of any QP here, I do have other skills that could be useful in a worst case scenario.

Mike

[The Reaper]

I guess this post has drifted a bit from its intended purpose of identifying what guns you would hit the trail with and how much you can actually carry, but as long as it seems to be beneficial, let's keep it going. Staying home was not an option and would tend to defeat the purpose of the thread.

If you don't like the scenario or the concept, no problem, start another one that you do like.

For those who have not used a dump pouch on your belt, I highly recommend it for foraging, dumping loose ammo, and dropping empty mags into.

I know that at my age, I do not move as quickly as I used to, never mind my family. Since I honestly am not sure they could all walk 100 miles in any reasonable time, I went with a solo scenario. The thoughts of having a motorcycle, an ATV, or a car to travel would be great, unless they were dead from an EMP or solar anomaly. I tend to agree that a bike, particularly as a cargo vehicle, would be outstanding except that they are pretty non-tactical and trail or road limited. If I were on that line of thought, a small folding trailer (either to be pulled or pulled behind the bike) would be a tremendous asset, again, pretty much limited to trail or road use. A cache (or multiple caches) en route at necessary intervals is another excellent idea. If you don't need them, you could leave them for later, or swap unnecessary items you are carrying for ones that you needed most at that time.

I don't think that airport or mass transit lockers are viable, post-9/11, I strongly suspect that they would be monitored and the rental periods would be short.

24/7 access storage units (or unsecured ones) would be great, especially if you don't mind having it in your name. I strongly suspect that the security on those would lapse pretty quickly, and if you have a set of bolt cutters with you, you are in.

No guns would be another way to go, but a pistol, at least a .22LR would IHMO, be much better.

When planning, you have to look for possibilities and contingencies. For those not familiar with the MDMP, I highly recommend it as a method of analyzing and developing multiple viable courses of action.

While you could assume "bugging in", that would not fit this scenario, and would probably be worthy of an entirely different plan.

Select from any of the below COAs that are viable for you, and game them out to see if they are viable.

• You can plan for evac to a safe location in your vehicle (to include boats) in advance of a disaster.
  
• You could assume a scenario with evac to a safe location in your vehicle or boat during a disaster.
  
• You can also assume evac to a safe location on backup motor vehicles or, if you have them, horses before or during a disaster.
  
• You need to plan for evac on bike to a safe location before or during a disaster.
  
• Finally, you need to plan for evac on foot to a safe location before or during a disaster.

I would consider caches or secure stopping points under each of the above plans. Even a vehicle needs fuel, for example, and your estimated consumption rate could be shot to hell with rerouting, traffic, etc.

Also consider that any of the above could turn into a foot movement if issues occur.

What if the major bridges are out, for example? From Fayetteville north, AFAIK, there are only two crossing points for the Cape Fear River from Sanford to Lillington. That is more than 30 miles. Can you swim it, with your gear and family?

Some plans will evolve from a vehicle, to a bike, to on foot, for example, or from a boat to an overland movement.

If you lose your vehicle and have to go afoot, be aware that you are probably going to have to dump or hide a lot of what you had and will then have to carry a reduced load on your backs for the rest of the journey.

You should also have a plan for what to do if you arrive at your destination and it is no longer viable, but again, that is another plan. That would have to include a contingency for discovering the destination is compromised before you leave, during your evac, or after your arrival.

Same for planning for the family movement. Given warnings, and sufficient lead time (for example a hurricane approaching), you could send them ahead or evacuate with them ahead of the disaster. However, you would have to have a contingency for unexpected disasters, just in case a tornado or solar storm occurred.

Great to have tire repair kits, jacks, hoses, etc., but have you ever used one, particularly only with the items you are carrying? Easy to do in the driveway or garage with floor jacks, jack stands, full range of wrenches, an air compressor, etc. Get out of your home and try to do that with the abbreviated tools you will be carrying. I am shocked at the number or people who have never even taken their jacks out of the car and assembled them, much less tried to lift the car with them.

Hope this helps.

TR

[NurseTim]

Silenced ruger mark III, water filter, dromedary 100 Oz., I EDC gorilla duct tape, mini bic, and victorinox cadet held together with cut inner tube from a bicycle. I'd grab a 550 round box for .22 and scedaddle.

Long gun will be a battlefield pick up, I suck at long range anyway. My aim is to harass whomever is tracking me, slow them down. Hit one, I hope four will attend to him/her. If not, hit as many as I can to slow the party down. Tape up my heels, move at night, debrie hut during day. On yeah, blackjack kukri with grunt should cover cutting needs. I also EDC trauma shears.

[grog18b]

My apologies my Brother. I read your scenario, and tried to fit it to my current life, as opposed to just sticking to the original premise. My bad. I do like the idea of a separate thread to discuss the possibilities I discussed earlier...

That said, and I had to bug out fast, the only weapons I would choose from my safe are my 22/ 22magnum pistol, and my 22 Remington Matchmaster rifle.

My reasoning is as follows... With those simple weapons you can defend yourself, kill anything you want to eat, and secure anything else you might need. They are reliable, not high maintenance, you can carry more than enough ammunition, as well as very quiet ammunition to remain undetected in your movement. They are easy to carry, and the Matchmaster could be broken down to fit inside the longer go bags. Also, as far as accuracy goes, I have never fired a 22 rifle like the Matchmaster I have. The scope is old, and has brass rings. It is post and cross hair, and the top of the post has a tiny notch. In that notch is where the bullet goes. All the time, every time. It also loves 22 shorts, although I have to hand feed those. The pistol I have is an old 22 revolver with an extra 22 magnum cylinder.

I would also grab the little black bag at the bottom of my safe. No need to go there in public.

GROG

[frostfire]

Great thread! Thanks TR. I learned and will continue to learn a lot.

With the 45 lbs starting point, I already have half trauma kit there, H2O, and bare necessisties.

So on the run lead launchers:
AK74 w/ 1-4x scope, 100 rds in 3 mags and one 10rds bundle in pack. Two mags on me. 55gr HP zeroed for center of mass hold from 50m to 200m. I have pinged torse size reliably at 400m. I can take the stock off and completely conceal it on me, shooting it with taut-sling method. I've tested it dry w/ no lubrication, dirty with WD40, wet after submerged. Zero malfunctions.

G17 with 60 rds. 2 mags on me. and 10 rds bundle in pack.
115 silver tip HP zeroed for center of mass hold from 3 yards to 110 yards. 9mm pellet shot for small game and "deterrent"

.177 pellet gun for small game with 100 pellets for small game and distractor(very light)

Maxpedition roly-poly dump pouch, Bear Mace, Benchmade Nimravus, Leatherman MUT, belt/neck knife, zip-ties, lock pick set

Terrain is urban, so dressed like a ragged homeless man w/ stinkum on, brownish stain on back of pants.

[Chaplain Scott]

OK: attached is a picture from my bedroom window. The terrain is open with little cover/concealment. Right behind our house is a creek that I would probably head to if I only had the allotted 5 min. heads-up. I'd grab my AR and a 5 or 6 Mags already loaded. (reasoning--reasonable balance with ammo weight/volume--best to NOT get in a firefight, but if can't avoid it, I want enough firepower to be able to hold my own or be able to break contact as needed) A few 1911 mags, primarily because the 1911 is already on my belt, so no time to change it out for my Sig.

Now, if the scenario is NOT solo:

I'd still grab the AR, and 1911, but would add the following:

My wife would get the AR-15-22 with 5 or 6 loaded .22 LR mags, and a 1911 with a couple of mags;

my son-in-law (who is currently in Active Reserve unit, and he and our daughter live on the ranch with us in our attached but separate mother-in-law place) would get one of my 1911's with mags and the .300 Weatherby w/ Leopold 4.5x14 scope--it would provide us some longer range fire if needed-he's also a better shot and in better shape than I am in to hump the rifle.

My daughter would get another AR with accompanying Mags and 1911 with a few mags; 10 yr old grandson would get my classic Remington Nylon 66 with a brick or two of .22LR and my 6 yr old granddaughter would get a a brick of .22LR and her grandmother's Ruger single-Six in 22LR.

IF we had time, we'd each grab a horse, bareback if need be, but my butt cringe's at that thought......