03-16-2004, 17:16
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#16
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JAWBREAKER
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Gulf coast
Posts: 1,906
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Litigation, overintrusive government regulations, irrational healthcare laws, inadequate judicial discretion concerning frivolous lawsuits, uneducated juries, unrealistic expectations of the patient and their family, complete exaggeration of the monetary value concerning punitive damages .....
Should I go on? I don't seem much problem with the actual providers and treatment received. I feel we have the best healthcare system anywhere.
Last edited by Sacamuelas; 03-16-2004 at 17:18.
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Sacamuelas is offline
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03-16-2004, 17:19
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#17
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Consigliere
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Free Pineland (at last)
Posts: 8,841
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Quote:
Originally posted by Sacamuelas
I don't seem much problem with the actual providers and treatment received.
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No, of course not. 
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Roguish Lawyer is offline
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03-16-2004, 17:20
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#18
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: LA
Posts: 1,653
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Both - the fear comes from the quantity. Its ridiculous that Docs aren't allowed to be human beings. Insurance, litigation - its all a big scam. If there is gross negligence, such as Surgicalcrip doing surigical crycs as an elective procedure, then sure there should be recourse. But not for honest mistakes made with best intentions.
Of course I could be wrong, the Law of Land Warfare doesn't really address malpractice. 
__________________
Somewhere a True Believer is training to kill you. He is training with minimal food or water, in austere conditions, training day and night. The only thing clean on him is his weapon and he made his web gear. He doesn't worry about what workout to do - his ruck weighs what it weighs, his runs end when the enemy stops chasing him. This True Believer is not concerned about 'how hard it is;' he knows either he wins or dies. He doesn't go home at 17:00, he is home.
He knows only The Cause.
Still want to quit?
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NousDefionsDoc is offline
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03-16-2004, 17:27
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#19
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Guest
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Quote:
Originally posted by Roguish Lawyer
The players:
Patients
Health Care Providers
Insurance Companies
Lawyers
Pharmaceutical Companies
State and Federal Government
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I'd say the problem is multifactorial. One is technology just keeps coming up with new and better for more and more money... and patients keep insisting on having it....whether it will give them 2 days more or 2 years more. Transplants, dialysis, meds which cost $10,000 a dose.... even a day in the ICU... people look up stuff on the internet and want to know why not for them....?
And everyday people cross the border simply to seek health care. Some save up enough money to get to the states and go straight to the ER knowing they will be cared for...not sure how to handle this but the price you pay when you have a procedure covers that fact that they don't pay.
Malpractice is getting ridiculous. In Miami i have friends paying upward of $100,000 a year to get coverage... The suits you hear about...some are justified, some are just plain silly....we need some kind of mediator board to listen to possible cases and rule on them prior to them being allowed to be submitted.... and, I hate to say it, but limitations on pain and suffering. $18 million dollars for losing your psychic powers after a CT scan...this is what a jury awards...lets get real. These are a doctors peers???
I think i read somewhere that CEOs of insurance companies and HMOs are some of the highest paid individuals in the country...not surprising.
My collection rate at this time is about 22 cents on the billable dollar....tell me any other field that would accept that. There is none.
This is rambling but don't have time for more...pager is going off.
doc t.
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03-16-2004, 17:34
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#20
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: LA
Posts: 1,653
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Quote:
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And everyday people cross the border simply to seek health care.
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Just had to go there, didn't you?
I'll be waiting. 
__________________
Somewhere a True Believer is training to kill you. He is training with minimal food or water, in austere conditions, training day and night. The only thing clean on him is his weapon and he made his web gear. He doesn't worry about what workout to do - his ruck weighs what it weighs, his runs end when the enemy stops chasing him. This True Believer is not concerned about 'how hard it is;' he knows either he wins or dies. He doesn't go home at 17:00, he is home.
He knows only The Cause.
Still want to quit?
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NousDefionsDoc is offline
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03-16-2004, 17:43
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#21
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Guest
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Quote:
Originally posted by NousDefionsDoc
Just had to go there, didn't you?
I'll be waiting.
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I am back...minor nothing.
it happens all the time. You cannot deny it. No need to warm up for a fight.
doc t.
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03-16-2004, 17:48
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#22
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: LA
Posts: 1,653
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What other choice do they have?
__________________
Somewhere a True Believer is training to kill you. He is training with minimal food or water, in austere conditions, training day and night. The only thing clean on him is his weapon and he made his web gear. He doesn't worry about what workout to do - his ruck weighs what it weighs, his runs end when the enemy stops chasing him. This True Believer is not concerned about 'how hard it is;' he knows either he wins or dies. He doesn't go home at 17:00, he is home.
He knows only The Cause.
Still want to quit?
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NousDefionsDoc is offline
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03-16-2004, 17:52
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#23
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Guest
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Quote:
Originally posted by NousDefionsDoc
What other choice do they have?
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that was not the question...the question was why are costs so high...that is one of the reasons. I don't refuse to treat nonfunded patients...I just know I won't get paid or compensated for doing it. Such is life.... but makes for a poor collection rate....and as i said before, there are not many people who work for free.
doc t.
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03-16-2004, 17:54
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#24
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Guerrilla
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: between the desert and the sea
Posts: 460
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ok now that i've seen what others on here think
It costs an incredible amount to get a drug (or investigational device) on the market, maybe more than any other product, so its a good thing that patents expire and generics are available. RL, perhaps there should be another player: regulating bodies (eg FDA).
I dont have any figures but I would not be surprised if HMO and insurance administrators are making bank and draining the system. The bureaucracy tends to proliferate itself. At first I thought that this would just be picking on them since they arent here to defend themselves.
The real problem is that we have this pseudo socialized medicine. Insurance is supposed to be the great homogenizer for care, but does it accomplish that? no. no it doesnt. I think the most we can hope for is to recreate our view of what medicine is for. Maybe there would be less lawsuits if people didnt view health care as a "scarce" commodity. There would be less HMO administrators making the lives of patients and providers into hell, because of a change in perception.
all IMHO
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pulque is offline
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03-16-2004, 17:57
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#25
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JAWBREAKER
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Gulf coast
Posts: 1,906
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Quote:
Originally posted by Roguish Lawyer
No, of course not.
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RL... got any smiles for Doc T's response too?
Let's hear your ideas since you must be the expert with all your experience in the field.
I have unfortunately had the displeasure of testifying as an expert witness in the 5th Circuit over frivolous claims. Here is the COST for just one lawsuit I was involved with two years ago :
1. Cost me two day's productivity due to office shutdown/downtime to testify after having to give a deposition beforehand and then testify in court on his behalf
2. The three ladies that worked for me at the time their pay as I was out of the office
3. My travel expenses
4. The defense lawyers hourly rate for pretrial/during trial work
5. Judge and all the court staff expenses paid by the gov.
6. Defendant Doctors time (several days), untold stress
7. The staff in the defendant Doctor's office that could not work without the Dr. present.
You want to know how much it cost the defendant AFTER the judge ruled that the case was frivolous and completely in favor of the defendant?
NOTHING, his attorney had taken the case for a portion of the verdict/settlement and this jackleg was unemployed and getting a government check.
OR
From your little quote to me, maybe you think the problems are mostly provider and treatment derived. Please elaborate.
Last edited by Sacamuelas; 03-16-2004 at 18:03.
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Sacamuelas is offline
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03-16-2004, 17:58
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#26
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: LA
Posts: 1,653
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Quote:
Originally posted by Doc T
that was not the question...the question was why are costs so high...that is one of the reasons. I don't refuse to treat nonfunded patients...I just know I won't get paid or compensated for doing it. Such is life.... but makes for a poor collection rate....and as i said before, there are not many people who work for free.
doc t.
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What do you think the impact of the Bush immigration proposal will be on this if it goes through?
__________________
Somewhere a True Believer is training to kill you. He is training with minimal food or water, in austere conditions, training day and night. The only thing clean on him is his weapon and he made his web gear. He doesn't worry about what workout to do - his ruck weighs what it weighs, his runs end when the enemy stops chasing him. This True Believer is not concerned about 'how hard it is;' he knows either he wins or dies. He doesn't go home at 17:00, he is home.
He knows only The Cause.
Still want to quit?
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NousDefionsDoc is offline
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03-16-2004, 18:03
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#27
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Guest
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Quote:
Originally posted by NousDefionsDoc
What do you think the impact of the Bush immigration proposal will be on this if it goes through?
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you mean the worker programs? Not sure that employers will have to offer insurance to workers.... so they will still be unfunded but working legally. Not sure what it will change. What do you think?
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03-16-2004, 18:07
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#28
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: LA
Posts: 1,653
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I don't think it will go through, but if it does, the employers should have to pay for insurance.
Let's watch the fight between the vampire and the jawbreaker. LOL
I can't argue with you, I'm scared.
__________________
Somewhere a True Believer is training to kill you. He is training with minimal food or water, in austere conditions, training day and night. The only thing clean on him is his weapon and he made his web gear. He doesn't worry about what workout to do - his ruck weighs what it weighs, his runs end when the enemy stops chasing him. This True Believer is not concerned about 'how hard it is;' he knows either he wins or dies. He doesn't go home at 17:00, he is home.
He knows only The Cause.
Still want to quit?
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NousDefionsDoc is offline
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03-16-2004, 18:10
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#29
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Guest
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Quote:
Originally posted by NousDefionsDoc
I don't think it will go through, but if it does, the employers should have to pay for insurance.
Let's watch the fight between the vampire and the jawbreaker. LOL
I can't argue with you, I'm scared.
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from what i understand they will still be deemed "temporary workers".... do employers have to offer insurance under those conditions...i didn't think so...
roguish lawyer? can you comment?
scared to argue with me...does that mean I WIN!
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03-16-2004, 18:13
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#30
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: LA
Posts: 1,653
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Quote:
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scared to argue with me...does that mean I WIN!
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DAMN! LOL - of course it does.
What I want to know is who's teaching all these nasty habits?
Note to self - I hate it when my own material gets used against me - be more careful.
__________________
Somewhere a True Believer is training to kill you. He is training with minimal food or water, in austere conditions, training day and night. The only thing clean on him is his weapon and he made his web gear. He doesn't worry about what workout to do - his ruck weighs what it weighs, his runs end when the enemy stops chasing him. This True Believer is not concerned about 'how hard it is;' he knows either he wins or dies. He doesn't go home at 17:00, he is home.
He knows only The Cause.
Still want to quit?
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NousDefionsDoc is offline
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