HK USP Full or Compact

[The Reaper]

The DAO is inevitably a longer, heavier trigger pull. And that is best case. In worst case, it stacks, creeps, loads, and generally feels like you are trying to drag a cinder block through a brushpile with your index finger.

It also makes it easy for anyone who recovers your gun to use it, and a large percentage of the LEOs shot in this country every year are shot with their issue weapons.

I see it as a solution to a non-existent problem.

Just my .02, YMMV.

TR

[82ndtrooper]

Originally Posted by The Reaper

The DAO is inevitably a longer, heavier trigger pull. And that is best case. In worst case, it stacks, creeps, loads, and generally feels like you are trying to drag a cinder block through a brushpile with your index finger.

It also makes it easy for anyone who recovers your gun to use it, and a large percentage of the LEOs shot in this country every year are shot with their issue weapons.

I see it as a solution to a non-existent problem.

Just my .02, YMMV.

TR

Can't agree more. I carry the USPc in condition one mode. With the hammer decocked it shortens the trigger pull just a tad, but not by much but it is noticeable.

Is their any handgun that can't be discharged in the hands of a bad guy ?? Most can quickly enough realize that the safety is on. This may give you a moment to seek cover but I don't see it taking long before he or she figures out that it's on safe.

Just my .02

[Razor]

Originally Posted by The Reaper

I see it as a solution to a non-existent problem.

This is the only part I'd disagree with, TR. The problem is that either folks don't want to train enough to learn to deal with the first shot DA pull on a DA/SA, or they (or their organization) are afraid of carrying an SA in Condition 1. So I guess there are two problems the DAO addresses--fear and laziness.

[SureFire Kid]

From my two years working sales in a gun shop, all I can really say is that whatever is most comfortable for you will be best. You already have experience shooting a DA/SA trigger with the M9. I carried a Sig P226 and really had no problems adjusting to the DA pull out of the holster and the SA pull thereafter.

One thing I have noticed in running training scenarios with someone not used to a DAO (or LEM or DAK) trigger is that they tend to anticipate the shot much more and become frustrated very easily because they pull the gun down before the shot is fired. Now, I know that that is bad form on their part, but it is something else to have to get used to. However, they have the same advantage as guys who shoot striker activated triggers (Glock, Springfield XD, etc) in that the trigger pull is always the same. Whichever way you go, try to keep your trigger systems as similar as possible (KISS).

The question of which would be better for daily carry or a gunfight goes back to you being comfortable. If you're comfortable with and like shooting it, you will shoot it more often. If you shoot it more often, you will become more proficient with it. If you are proficient with it, it will be the best thing for you, regardless of wether it is a DA/SA, SAO (1911), DAO, DAK, LEM, or striker-activated. Hope this helps.


SFK

[ccrn]

I dont mind training to use a weapon. Ive already trianed with the M9 as it is so shooting another DA/SA trigger is not going to bother me.

On the contrary, Im just trying to understand the benifits of both actions. Personally it feels weird to me that a handgun would not have a manual safety especially in the civilian sector.

While we're on that topic can anyone enlighten me to the advantages to all the configurations of the USP ie safety and decocker, just decocker etc especially for daily carry?

Thanks for the comments-

[Team Sergeant]

Originally Posted by SureFire Kid

From my two years working sales in a gun shop, all I can really say is that whatever is most comfortable for you will be best. SFK

SureFire Kid,

These are the type of posts that make my hair stand on end. You've got just enough knowledge to be dangerous with no real training or experience to form a real professional opinion.

Save the weapon advice for other forums, at least until you've gone to a few Special Forces shooting schools, then, we'd be happy to hear your "Professional" opinion.

Team Sergeant

[SureFire Kid]

Roger that


SFK

Originally Posted by Team Sergeant

SureFire Kid,

These are the type of posts that make my hair stand on end. You've got just enough knowledge to be dangerous with no real training or experience to form a real professional opinion.

Save the weapon advice for other forums, at least until you've gone to a few Special Forces shooting schools, then, we'd be happy to hear your "Professional" opinion.

Team Sergeant

[Smokin Joe]

Originally Posted by ccrn

The guys that ran the course, including some LEO types, feel that the DAO is better for self defense as its simpler to use, and some said more defensable in court

Please don't tell me a cop told you this.

If you shoot someone it doesn't matter what type of trigger, safety, gizmo or other anti-felon device you have on your gun.

Lethal for is lethal force and you:

A) intended to use that level of force or not.
AND
B) you were justified in that use of force or not.

Don't listen to gun store commandos who try and muddy the water with the above issues. Lethal force is pretty cut and dry when you get down to it.

If I'm going to shoot someone I want the biggest most accurate gun I can find. Something that puts a nice 3-4 diameter hole in someones chest. Now, being that I can't carry any incendiary or explosive rounds I'm kind of limited to a few options. I use the biggest, most accurate, and reliable pistol I'm allowed to carry. For me that is a pistol with a Single action trigger. I get the same trigger travel, tension, and break every time. I don't need to worry about a different trigger travel, tension, nor short stroking the trigger.

Thats just my opinion. Some Professionals on here don't mind a DA/SA trigger and some do. I say try both and make up your own conclusions.

HTH

[ccrn]

Yes, in fact an LEO did tell me that.

And Ive read that on the web too including LEO forums that I get hits on while searching.

Ive also had an LEO that works at a local gunshop call BS for the very reasons you stated though he did admit he's also heard that juries can be influenced hence why some guns and ammo has had their names changed-

[ccrn]

Why I struggled with this I dont know.

Maybe from hearing from so many that HK is overpriced etc etc and that there are quite a few other "combat handguns" for much less.

Anyway, I found a 6 month old USPc in 45 for $540.00 after mil discount. It took awhile to find a deal but they are to be had. With my not so experienced eyes I cannot see any wear and tear what so ever on this piece. Its in DA/SA as recommended.

I have to say this is one beautiful piece of equipment. I couldnt be happier.

Thanks for all the comments-