TS:
Quote:
"Actually I've seen that fat range Sgt, teaching 40 y/o techniques at more than one LEO range.
Can the SF'ers and SEALS deal with terrorists, I doubt it with current LEO ROE.
We've already seen first hand what two bank robbers can do to 100 of Americas finest, the LAPD. I've no doubt what 5-10 armed terrorists will do if and when it happens, no doubt at all.
TS"
Yes, I have seen them too! As I said, don't judge all LE agencies by the ones you happen to see, with such people.
As for the currant LEO ROE, I don't know that their is a LEO standard set of ROE's for terrorists. They would be handled just like any armed hostage taker or takers, at least on first contact.
As for ROE's, apparently there are some problems in this area for Special Operations people as well. (The case that I mentioned, as well as the on going MARSOC case.
As for the LAPD case, yes we all saw that; however, most departments nation wide, to include LAPD have reviewed that incident and have better prepared LEO's for such incidents. Most departments LEO's are now allowed to carry a carbine or rifle in their patrol vehicle, for that type of incident. BTW: I think the LAPD officers involved in that incident showed extreme bravery under the circumstances.
As for TR's remarks on the LEO's in-action at 'Columbine.' Yes, we all saw that as well. Again, this incident was reviewed and the mistakes noted. This in-action, really stemmed from the SOP that most departments had at the time, especially those with SWAT teams.
The responding units were supposed to form a perimeter and contain the incident, until SWAT arrived to make an entry. The idea was that most individual patrol officers were not equipped or trained to make dynamic entries, etc. Along with an entry by individual LEO's could cause the hostage taker to harm a hostage, as well as the danger to that individual LEO.
(IMHO, if I would have been the responding officer and the hostage taker was shooting hostages, I would have entered and taken action. This may have resulted in a reprimand; however, a few more hostages might still be here.)
Any way, as in the LAPD case, most all LE Departments, have adjusted their SOPs and now first responders (Supervisor or a senior officer) will form teams out of those that respond make an entry and take care of the problem. They will also have the access to so called patrol carbines and/or rifles.
I hope that in all of my discussion here on this subject, that the point that I'm really trying to bring out, is that here in the USA any hostage situation is going to be responded to by local LE. If it is in their jurisdiction, it will be handled by them until such time that is decided it's a federal case, etc.
BTW: I also wonder, given the operational tempo of Special Operations units in the GWOT, (Delta in particular,) if they are prepared to respond, with what the need in a timely manner, to such an incident (Russian school) here in CONUS? How many hours would it take?
Who do you think is going to be there handling the ongoing situation, until HRT or the military (Delta) arrives. My read is, first local LE w/SWAT Team, (if determined its a Federal case,) the local FBI and local FBI SWAT Team, followed by HRT and/or the needed military unit.