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Originally Posted by kgoerz
History shows Countries that surrender don't fare to well. Even if they have excuses for surrendering.
We invade a country with a promise of a better life. During our stay there the infrastructure is obliterated. The going gets ruff. Then we pull out thinking it will rehabilitate our image  Don't think other people don't see that the large majority of Americans are not even effected by this war yet. Think our image is negative now. The new image after abandoning Iraq will be that we are weak, easily defeated, never to be trusted again. There is no rehabilitating from that.
Our children's children will be living with the consequences. I don't see us swinging any big swords in the future if we leave Iraq without being pushed out first. It would be the biggest Roll Over and Piss on yourself move in history. |
Exactly.
Even after we dumped the Vietnam War back in the laps of the Vietnamese, widely viewed globally as "cutting and running", the impression of the US was damaged. Despite the huge tactical and strategic forces deployed across the planet in opposition to the Soviets, we were seen as weak. The Army and the people in it, were crushed and defeated in spirit for many years. When I came in in 1979, the Army was seen as a place for losers and misfits. I had a platoon full of dopers, racists of all colors, drop-outs, and general malcontents. People changed into civvies before going home so that their neighbors would not know what they did for a living.
We had to win in Grenada, Panama, and Desert Storm before shaking that rep, and the mere loss of 18 men in Mogadishu after which we "withdrew" started it all over again.
I do not want to see this happen, but I fear if we leave before accomplishing our mission, we weaken the image of the US, the national will of the country, the core of the military and how it will be perceived domestically and internationally.
After the liberation of Afghanistan and Iraq, the Axis of Weasels walked lightly and had their hats in hand. Now they kidnap and kill our soldiers with impunity. Why? Because we have shown weakness.
It would be better for us internationally to kill everyone in Iraq as a statement of power than to cut and run declaring the war lost. If we pull out before killing every bad guy there (and more arrive or are created every day), then we are going to see the NKs, Iranians, and their ilk developing nukes full speed ahead in clear violation of any treaty we might negotiate with them. Because we will be seen as weak, and the only way we can shake that is to show some power on a grand scale, like nuking the shit out of the Iranian or NK nuclear sites. They will attack us overseas and here at home, as our demoralized and defeated military hides in shame.
No, we have to win this before mentioning coming home, put a strong personality in charge (our Saddam), or just start lashing out at everyone who crosses us, beginning with the Iranians, and damn the consequences. To do otherwise is to doom our children to finishing this later and at much greater cost, probably on our own soil. And get started on an alternate energy program.
"Power flows from the muzzle of a gun." Or walk softly and carry a big stick, preferably with a pointy nail in it.
TR