[tk27]

Originally Posted by CoLawman

We are and will remain the Ugly Americans in the Middle East until all terrorist organizations are defanged, Islamic Theocracies are abolished, and Radical Mullahs are tried for the war crimes they currently sanction.

Sir, I disagree with the notion that we will be liked only if something were to change, if we could only change the lense in which we are viewed. Our country is exceptional in that we have such a strong liberal Judeo-Christian value of accepting everyone. But in the history of the world are we the exception or the rule? Has the success of this experiment called America blinded us to the ugly reality of human natures ability to hate? Especialy hatred of outsiders who wield extordinary influence and power.

Originally Posted by CoLawman

In my simple mind the Soviet Union was a far superior challenge than the Arab world. Half the battle has already been won in the Middle East. Egypt, of all countries, is a moderate state. Lebanon and Iraq have had legitimate elections. Libya no longer wants to be a rogue nation. Pakistan, it can be argued, is a legitimate partner of ours in the war against terror. Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, Yemen, Qatar, UAE, and Algeria governments are passive in their disllike for American foreign policy.

Again, respectfuly I disagree. The Cold War was a game of nations in balance of power politics. It was simple by comparison. I would say the analogy between the two does not fit, and is not a good model to use.
In the thread that spawned this there was discussion of the movie Syriana, while the movie holds little more then entertainment value IMHO (Baer's Sleeping with the Devil and to a lesser extent See No Evil of which the movie was based off of are excellent), the tagline "Everything is Connected" was spot on. This is the fusion of religion, history, politics, energy, politics and nature all together, and they are all connected.

Originally Posted by CoLawman

I understand that this is still a formidable problem, but not as desperate a situation as MSM makes it out to be. I like our odds of winning this war.

It is desperate, this is a life and death struggle for the future of the modern world. Oil is the life blood that allows for industrialization, that allows for industrial agriculture, what is needed to keep the extra 5 billion people the world has added since we harnessed oil and moved subsistence agriculture.
I do not think this is a war, the term war implies somekind of endgame, a victor, a parade. I think this is a struggle, that nobody is going to win, I am sorry I do not share your optimism.

Originally Posted by CoLawman

In the good old days we would all meet at the park for a football game. Two captains were selected and they picked their team, one player at a time. (Sorry Firebeef, did not mean to bring up bad memories from your youth) Anyway look at the countries standing there. You darn right.... I would take Israel and Britain with my first two picks. And remember I am America.

I consider myself fortunate to have lived through the peace and prosperity of the tail end of the Cold War and the illusion of Pax Americana in the 90's. This, this keeps me up at night.

Originally Posted by CoLawman

Does not matter that we will be playing on their home field. Does not matter that the stands will be filled with their fans. At the end of the game all of that won't matter. What matters is the score.

Does not matter what they think while we are kicking their ars. Of course they don't like us or the reality of getting their ars kicked. Do we quit playing the game because they are calling us names, or yelling about us being cheaters or bullies. Heck no.....we keep kicking their ars.

While I dont think zero-sum thinking applys well to the situation, you will never find me objecting to kicking ass. We have no choice.


I'm sorry I am being longwinded here, I've been doing alot of thinking on the mater recently and this kind of allows me to tie it all together. CoLaw, I enjoy this conversation and ones like it on PS, I am looking forward to hearing what others have to say on the matter. My current occupation of mixing cocktails for tourists is not conductive to intelligent conversation, so I appreciate being allowed to participate.