swim class in phase II
 

When i took the swim test in selection i didnt make it the whole 50 meters. After i got seleceted i asked the SFAS cadre about it and he said they give a swim class during phase II. I've been taking lessons here on my homestation to get ready for the test, but if they are giving a swim class id like to those also, I know you have to pass the swim test to go to the next phase so id like to take full advantage of any classes they would give.

thanks in advance.

doc22584,

You need to become a fish in the water before you attend SFAS or even think about joining Special Forces.

Those three lighting bolts on our patch stand for "Land Sea and Air". So you’ve got a one in three chance of being assigned to a Scuba or water team.

I've know a few SF soldiers that have died from drowning while on active duty. You need to be an animal in the water. If you are a weak swimmer you need to become a strong swimmer. (else john kerry might have to rescue you and I’d sure hate to have that hanging over my head for decades)

The only thing more fun than swimming across Drowning Creek in the dead of winter is first breaking the ice in order to swim it. Ever wonder why they named it "Drowning Creek"?

Become an animal in the water, you want to be the rescuer not the rescue-ee!

Go to your base pool and find a swim instructor.


Team Sergeant

I'm not sure about anyone else's experience but there was no swimming, besides getting artied and maybe some night crossings...lol, in phase II. Though they did make some changes to Phase II recently. We did take another swim test when arriving to Student Co. but some people asked about a swim class and no one knew what they were talking about. If you have time before you get to Student Co. then find a buddy that can swim very well and have him train you up in the water. Swimming is not hard, just technique, but it is important! Plus, I know a lot of ODA's for Sage are doing Water PT, while we wait to go to Sage. I can't speak for being on a Team yet, as I am not there (2 months left in the Q), so listen to TS on that one.

-skipjack

I can swim, but the cadre at SFAS told me i was a weak swimmer and that i would have to take the 2 week swim class. Im currently taking swim lessons right now.

Team Sergeant,

I got my info from this website. http://www.soc.mil/swcs/Pipeline.shtml

Under the pre-req's they state that a 2 week class is offered just prior to the start of the Q. If you or anyone else knows if they still offer that class i would greatly appreciate some insight.

Doc-
Listen to TS, there were more failures in my PrePhase (SFAS now) than anything else - over 40% due to swimming. ALL Teams swim, and work on water ops - train up now don't wait. Get in the pool, get in the lake, get in the ocean, get in the river - they all have their own personalities once you are in them at night dragging your ruck behind you. Tactical swimming is mostly core work - sidestroke, breaststroke, kicking with fins on your stomach and on your back- get very good, plus it is amazing exercise.

7. Pass a 50 meter swim with BDU's & boots (diagnostic given at SFAS, test upon arrival at SFQC): there is a 2-week swim course offered just prior to SFQC if one fails the diagnostic at SFAS...enlisted only (this 2-week prep course is not mandatory)

So let me get this straight, you're willing to bet/hope that this two week course will get you where you think you will need to be for the test given at SFQC? That's a mighty big wager. If the guys told you at SFAS you were a weak swimmer that was your wake up call. If you arrive again, weak, pray the same instructor is not giving the same test at SFQC.....;)

You need to forget that class and get to work on swimming now.

I cannot tell you if that is still being offered but the SFAS SGM might be able to..... (Someone want to give the SGM a shout? ;) )

TS

I went to a pool today and i did the 50 meter swim sucessfully. My reason for asking about the class is so i can get more pool time with a qualified instructor.

Swimming
 

Mine used to get in the pool with his rucksack on and tread water...good old waterpolo practice!

blustr18b

Doc,

I am stepping a little out of my lane.......but, I do have some experience around water. The QP's have told you to swim. You do not need a swim instructor or coach. You are not working on your turns and starts. You are working on your endurance and muscle development.

How many accomplished runners waited around for a coach or instructor?

You are losing valuable time. 50 meters is not nearly enough to make you an accomplished swimmer. That is a minimum standard. Go to the pool, lake or river and swim. Nice slow pace for 30 minutes. rest as needed. When you can do a 30 minute swim without needing a rest..........you are ready.

My Credentials: My daugher was a 5 time All American and Team Captain on her College team. Her specialty was the mile. Her dad had her swimming lakes, rivers, and pools, without a stop watch or concern for technique at the formative stages.:lifter

I bet Mr. Harsey has a few tips on swimming.

We had very few guys fail the swim test in my track, and the ones who did went to the pool by themselves everyday (In addition to PT sessions) for the last few months to get better at swimming. They are all advnacing with us to Phase II.

I am no great swimmer (Read: not a competative swimmer) but I got out of the pool after the swim test and wasn't even breathing hard... I try to get into the pool to swim for an hour at least twice a week.

My $.02 FWIW...

Doug

Swim Test in Phase II
 

In the past, Student Company has provided swim training for weak swimmers before Phase II. I know that they give a must-pass test to all incoming Students, but I don't know if the lessons are still offered. I'll check and post the answer. I do know this - Drowning Creek is full and running strong right now. Knowing how to swim before you come to SFAS is a good thing (free advise to anyone coming to SFAS Class 8-06).

You don't want to be a "weak" anything in SF.

When I was on a Strat Recon Team with Reaper, we also had small boat and scout swimming missions. If you have limitations on your infil method, you might not get to go. It would suck to be left behind because you were "weak". It would suck even more to drown or watch a Teammate drown.

If you are weak at something, it is your responsibility to get up to speed on it.

I was just wondering...How much of the earth's surface is covered by water?

Doc-

Another .02 to toss in the ring here. 50 m in a warm pool with lifeguards is a hell of a lot different than a 2 mi infil in freezing water, in a dry suit, dragging a ruck, and navigating. Falling out of an RB 15 in the middle of the night loaded for bear, even with a BC ain't something you want to do as a weak swimmer. Finding the one hole in waist high river and falling over 'cause your ruck is so heavy, calls for you and the 3 guys nearest you to be really good swimmers.

No lifeguards, no excuses, your life and your buddy's life depend on not only being a swimmer but a strong swimmer. Oh, at least when I was in, runs would be supplemented with "Lake Swims" for PT - run for a while, then swim across/around a lake - run some more, and swim a little more, then run back to the Team House.

Bud, swimming is in your job description, get good at it.

When Waterborne Operations goes bad.
 

Speaking of swimming,

Last night we did a RAMZ MFF with a two hour window to RV with a helo IOT FAC an underway transload and the friggin bottle was entangled with the chutes so bad that it almost took the whole two hours just to inflate the damn Zodiac.

We (5 man team) took turns keeping the package from sinking and diving down to cut the package free from its container. In the darkness of the night with a chemlight and all kinds of silk/suspension lines in the water on a breath hold it isn’t exactly a good time. You definitely need to be comfortable in the water to say the least and you won't be if you're not competent in the water (an early prerequisite is being a strong swimmer).

I’m not sure if you’ll do RAMZ in SF but I’m very sure SF does waterborne ops and being in the water at night trying to link up with a MH-53/MH-47 with all that rotor wash, and an unforgiving sea-state all the while trying to keep your teammates in close proximity (read: arms length separation) and trying to grab onto a rope ladder that’s moving away from you can be a little hairy.

I've been in the pool everyday swimming and i've got my confidence up. I dont panic in the water anymore so thats a plus. I'm fairly confident in my swimming abilities now and am confident about the swim test. I understand what everyone is saying about getting better at swimming. Ill be in the pool everyday until its second nature to me.

Doc-
We're trying to let you know swimming is a very important part of your chosen career path. If you can get to lakes, rivers, the ocean - practice in them too, your buddies that are strong swimmers will probably want to go with you, for the practice, and as a cameraderie thing - keep working on it, you'll probably get to the point that you find swimming fun.

I understand that swimming is very important, and i appreciate everyone help and suggestions. I mean it only makes sense that you have to be able to swim if you want to be a QP. Like someone said earlier, those 3 lighting bolts stand for LAND, SEA and AIR.

A little more than 70%.

TS, was that 'someone.' doc.....

x_ made a good point as well. There will be times you may have to use the 'crawl'. Most of it will be..... ohhhh how to put all this in type? Most will be with fins, more than likely, wearing a 'dry suit', other times a 'wet suit', at times, neither.

Have more here than I feel like typing. However. One example:
In Toelz, most the Teams were mountain Teams. My Team, received orders to go to Greece for Amphib/Scout swimming school. Training was a month. There was no swimming school or test when I went through SFTG.

In Greece we started everday with a 5 mile run. Several times a week, we had 'swims'. They varied from 2 miles to 5 miles, along with the other training, RB15s and such. We worked with the Greek army. When my Team and the other Team swam, we were tethered to a Greek soldier, not to mention that our instructors made a point of dropping us whatever given miles out in the 'Med,' knowing damn well the tide would be going out. I thought Greeks were swimmers/divers. NOPE. We tried towing these guys to shore. That got old after an hour and more, even on a two mile swim. The next day, we towed thier lazy asses for a mile or so, talking, yelling...... then un-hooked the 5 foot or so 'bubby line' ...... Waving buh bye.

That is a nutshell thing. It comes to..........you'd best be able to swim for hours in any conditions. If you want more on those conditions, I'm sure there are many of us on here that can fill you in.

Bottom line......... You aren't swimming a whatever stroke for a Gold Medal. You need the stamina in the water, just as you do on land. At times both!!!

That's great cause the first time you jump off a BlackHawk into 2 feet of water carrying an M-240 or M-249 with a thousand rounds of ammo, grenades etc and find out the water is really 12 feet deep you will know what it is to be a SF soldier.

The first time I stepped off a Navy landing craft was after we "hit" a sandbar 100 meters from shore. I watched the first two guys "disappear" carrying the basic load of infantry equipment. I also "disappeared" for a minute while carrying the M-60 right behind them.....

If you do not learn to control your emotions they will control you. If you panic in SF at anytime you will be gone.

TS

That's a fact. I am negatively bouyant, can dive in a pool and sit on the bottom and basically have to work to stay a float. The hardest thing I ever had to do was when I was a midshipman (don't ask) in the US Merchant Marine Academy at Kings Point was tread water for 30 minutes without being allowed to change my position. For me, swimming is not relaxing it is extreme PT.

I'm in the same boat. I have spent some time trying to improve my endurance in the water, but never got outstanding results. I spent a lot of time trying to refine my stroke to rule that out as the reason I suck so bad. What drives me crazy is that I can run to no end, but I swim 50 meters and I'm suckin.

COL Jack-
you went to school at the north end of Little Neck Bay? I used to sail Blue Jays, Lasers, etc. right by your Alma Mater(grew up on the SE end of the bay, home of the Sappho) - got to sail the 12's out of KP a few times. I loved getting the idiots to follow a blue jay through the slot at Stepping Stones.

To the point of the Thread - we also used to swim from the south end of the bay to the south jetty at KP, rest for 20 minutes and swim back - crossing Udalls Cove/Great Neck Estates was the worst part - had to cross open water without any warning to boaters - didn't realize I was training for SF as a kid.

I doubt it was at the same time, I read somewhere that Colonel Sir cut his naval teeth on triremes at Arginusae...;)

As the drum guy, or a rower?

I know it wasn't at the same time - he would have been there from the year I was born till the time I was about 4. I think the Reliant and Sappho were still sailing back then..... It still amazes me that COL Jack went to the easiest "Military Academy" in the US. I just cannot see the COL as a Merchant Marine (boy, there's an oxymoron)

Piper on the Hephaistia

"We keep you alive to serve this ship. So row well, and live!"

Neither could I, but that, as they say, is another story. I left there and graduated from the University of Maine. Of course, you must realize with the timeline you all have relegated me to, one of my visiting professors was a Viking on sabatical from pillaging along the coast of Newfoundland.

Leif or Eric? I understand they were both visiting professors at the USMMA during your stay. I understand Jason gave a few guest lectures too, there was a nice write up on his "Song of the Sirens, or 101 uses for beeswax and wool for your crew" lecture.

Here's a little info on why you have to swim. I don't know how dated this is but most of the other information on the page looks accurate. Take it FWIW.
From the Special Operations Reference Manual.

Well....
 

Well after Kyobanim's post this would be a good time to tell about the time I was pinned to the side door of a Submarine while it was underway.

Told that to a pre-scuba class one time and one guy picked up his gear and turned in in on the spot.

If you want the rest of the story you'll have to make it through the course and get together with some of us old farts at the GB Club.


In the middle of nowhere, with limited help around or at O-Dark thirty is not the time to find out you were weaker in some areas than you thought. Really bad for the team also.

Pete

Why is it that the wrench likes to get thrown into things at around 0230 Hours?

Kyo-
looks like what I remember - but my brain got frozen a few times, and water logged a few more than that. Ah yes, rubber pajamas with feet and a hood, and no way to pee on a long swim...


Pete- 0230 is the magic hour, when you're on the ramp and the jump gets scrubbed, when you're thinking infil is in 4 hrs, and they tell you to suit up now 0300 dive in the water with a sweet little 2 mi swim, the grenade and arty sims go off on the first night idoors in a month at Camp McK, when you get busted sneaking the girl out of the barracks by the SGM....

Now that brings up the time I was going through "my" barracks checking "my" rooms one afternoon.

I went into one young Staff Sergeant's room and a naked young lady waked out of the bathroom. She of course gave a little scream and jumped behind a wall locker door. She wanted to know what I was doing in the room.

I explained to he that it was not her room and not the SSG's room, it was my room. I also told her that if she saw him before I did to tell him I wanted to see him in my office.

Just another "chat" in my office.

Pete

Why did the Perry Mason "da, dah, dah, dum" just play in my head - oh, yeah - getting called to task by Team Daddy or Smash myself one or two (okay, a few) times - for various deficiencies/issues/women. the best times were when you got laughed at, not verbally bounced off a locker.

SFQC
 

In reference to reporting to SFQC how far out should you recieve orders if you report to PLDC/BNCOC in the Nov class?
TAN-

According to the transition/levy people here at my unit you get them 60 days out, so you should either have yours already or they should be on there way.

T2G, please fill out your profile more fully if you are going to be posting.

TR

X SF MED: That was not Jason. That was Odysseus. Jason did the lecture on various metalic wool garments. :D

Is being comfortible in more that one style of swimming important or should one built endurance first?

My bad - you are correct - Odysseus did the Sirens, Jason did the Gold Wool drysuit lecture, imagine the BC you'd need with that, including not burping the suit.

The answer to your other question is - Yes. You can switch swimming styles during the course of your swim, as long as you just keep going,and going, and going.....