I just ran a pair through the dirt, catus, and rocks in the NM desert for about a week acting in an OPFOR capacity. (bought them from Botach - online)

Bottom line is that I am extremely happy with them. Even though I was daily picking catctus out of my shins - not one got through the boot.

The only thing I noticed was that there was a very small sole seperation at the toe of the boot from the leather. I was constantly in and out of the prone and kneeling positions though.

Great vibram soles !! Overall, I would buy another pair.

I didn't want to start a whole new thread for boots, so I'll put this here.

Here's my question: What boots would the QPs here recommend for cold-weather wear, where the snow is knee-deep over ankle-twisting rocks?

I always thought that Gore-Tex was a two way membrane.It doesn't let rain in but lets perspiration out.I always buy my boots WITH Gore-Tex because my feet sweat.I drive for a living and am always in the weather,so I've always gone for footwear with G-Tex.
Have I been doing it wrong,or is it just a matter of personal preference?
Thank you.

Your definition is correct.

However, boots with GoreTex tend to be hot, as the membrane does not pass moisture out as fast as feet produce it while humping in the field, and if you step in water over the tops, they will fill up and not drain easily.

TR

I'm not a QP but...
I would recommend these:
If you are going to be using crampons:
http://www.vasque.com/products/m-alpine-gtx.cfm
or
Any Asolo that will accept crampons.

If you are not going to be using crampons I like these:
http://www.danner.com/geek_specs.asp?id=1783
Danners again
I have friends that swear by these but I have no first hand expericene with the company:
Wolverines

With snow that deep you need gortex pants or tall gaitors I like taking both because gaitors are light and pack easy. You might be able to save your ankles with snow shoes (depending on the density of the snow).

YMMV

Thanks for explaining that.I never realized that Gore-Tex boots would be hotter.

Bates boots - tropical durashocks, good boots
 

I've had a pair(4 years, yeah the same well worn, world traveling pair) of E00924 Men's Bates DuraShocks® 8" Tropical, http://www.batesfootwear.com/Catalog...Type=undefined
The sole is really tough, the upper is canvas/cordra. I have more boots, goretex lined as well, than Imelda Marcos has shoes, http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/asi...ic/1173911.stm, these are my choice to take to the field. The steel toe has saved me a couple of times from having a heavy equipment case squish my toes. They dry fast and pack into small spaces. Have I mentioned they are comfortable. I work mostly in hot climates, these might not be great for cold weather. Needless to say when I heard a had an upcoming all expense paid government trip to the desert I ordered the desert version. The Sportsman guide website had them on sale, $59 and fast shipment. http://www.sportsmansguide.com/cb/cb.asp?a=140681
I don't get a kickback from any of the companies mentioned, these are just my experiences. Semper Gumby, stay flexible.

Are the Bates M-9 Assault boots allowed at SFAS? Has anyone used the 8" tropicals by Bates?

Let this one be, folks; I'll handle it. :rolleyes:

Razor put me in my place and I apologize for wasting space with this dumb-ass question. The search button is a wonderful thing.

Found em here (http://www.botac.com/baasbo1.html) for $79.95 with free shipping.

Damn, looks like my CSM thinks they're too sporty to wear with a uniform. Oh well.

Interested in SFAS? Call the recruiter and go. I was in Selection within two weeks of casting a shadow on the doorstep of the SF recruiter's office. He'll give you the approved "latest & greatest" SFAS packing list as you complete the SFAS packet... I wouldn't be concerned if a particular boot is allowed or not. Boots don't make the man... plain old jungle boots have been worn on quite a few feet of SFAS Selectees.

Mr. 'P':

I was impressed by the original posts on this boot so bought a pair a couple weeks ago through Onlineshoes.com.

I think Bates is on to something with these boots. I can't take any type of insulated boot unless the temp goes below freezing and was worried that these boots would cause too much sweat in temps over forty and rain. However I have been wearing them almost daily for the last week in temps in the mid 50s - 60s with rain and have found them to actually be decent in terms of coolness.

I took a pretty decent tree down by my house over the weekend so abused them considerably with no ill effect. I did note after nine hours of tree removal and splitting that my quads felt like I had done a very heavy squat and dead lift work out. Very unusual for me. I think there is something to a fellows post about them being hard on the legs in terms of balance. Their soles are rugged and quite soft at the same time. Seems my legs are having to move quite a bit to keep balance due to the cushoning of the heel part of these boots and I think this may have something to do with my quads being sore.

However, my feet, knees, and back are so screwed up that any boot that allows me to stay on my feet for ten or twelve hours straight without causing agony in my feet, knees, and back is pretty good IMHO. I finished a nine hour day on a range today without one iota of agony so I am pretty happy with them.

I found the size to be absolutely perfect and they support high arches quite well in fact. My feet wll swell when they get hot so I need boots that may be a bit wider than medium and with round toes. These Bates boots are well designed for my dogs.

I am also surprised at the light weight of these particular boots. They don't make a sound when wet and moving across smooth surfaces. Very innovative. No more embarrassing moments squeeking away while walking across polished floors.

Oh yes, I stepped in a pile of relatively fresh dog ---- with them today so was able to evaluate the ability of the tread to clean out easily. They seem to 'throw' mud like substances pretty efficiently and rinse off with water quite easily. Lugged soles that throw mud or mud like substances indicates good design IMHO.

I am pretty impressed with these boots. May have taken the Army 200 plus years but perhaps they found something for the dogs that actually works.

Gene

Oh man... I just got my new Danner Desert Acadia's extra broke in, I have my Oakley's (2 pr), and Group keeps issuing us the ACU boot likes it going outta style. So now I'm gonna have to order a pair of these and give the old torture test too? Whaddaya think Razor? Test 'em on Bar Camp Trail after a couple Incline iterations?

For extreme cold weather I'd go for these http://www.mgear.com/pages/product/p.../0/item/103676

Anyway's these boots, are good for extreme mountaineering, crampon compatible, plus they have a liner, which if it gets wet, you can pull it out of your boot, and put it in your sleeping bag, to dry. Then the next morning, knock the ice off the outer boot, and put on your dry liners. But they are pretty pricey, so only worth it, if you are going to use them alot.

$515 for boots?? Ouch! I think I'll go with the Bates for $79.95 from Botach.

Like I said, only worth it if you use them alot, or you convince your unit to buy them.

I wore issued jungles 99% of my career. They wore like iron, dried in no time, and in my opinion they were great to fight (kick and stomp) with. The only down side was I remember was when I worked a staff job they were hard on your legs/feet when constantly on concrete or tile surfaces.

$515 for boots, not in this life time.:rolleyes:

TS

For the last three years...this is what I've been wearing.:lifter

Take care.

I have a slightly older model of the ones I posted, they cost 450 dollars at the time. I sure as hell didn't pay for them, luckily I was on a mountain team at the time, and we just had to have them.:D

Good boots
 

Prospect, You might want to try thicker socks (not two pairs). If you can find a flat insole, place it under the boots original insole to raise the foot up. That will reduce the volumne of the boot.

Problem with two pairs of thick socks ( liner and a thick sock is OK) is that they will proportionally enlarge the size of your feet. Our feet don't grow that way. That could effect the way the boot fit to your feet.

Other thing you might doe, is to have a boot fitter pad the tongue of the boot.

Great point Hollis. Fix it from the top of the boot to top of your foot, not bottom of your foot to bottom of the boot. Seems like you'd end up w/a more stable platform that way. Also, I think your feet will transfer more energy to the ground with less between them and the sole.

The thicker socks idea works fine (i obtained some of the wigwam ingenious socks soon after i got the boots), although ultimately i decided to sell them to one of the guys on my fireteam (at an incredibly reduced price; consequence of me being in too much of a hurry). I plan on obtaining another pair when i get back to the states and am able to size them better. I appreciate the comments/ideas though, good food for thought.

As long as they are fitted properly and are appropriate for the environment, boots are probably 30% of the equation. Socks and insoles are probably worth another 10%. Conditioning is more like 60%. I know guys who wear no socks and can start a 25-mile march with newly issued jungle boots, and do just fine.

OTOH, you can Gucci out all you want with $500 boots, $50 insoles, and $20 socks, but if you do not spend the time breaking them in properly and conditioning your feet to the task at hand, at best, you are just wasting money and will be waiting by the road with your blistered feet on fire for the chase vehicle to pick you up. At worst, you will make the rest of your team carry you and you may compromise the mission and get a teammate killed.

Be smart, if you are a student, buy, break in, and train up in what you are told to. If you are a team guy, you should be smart enough (having gotten there) to pick the appropriate gear, prepare it properly (but not till it is worn out), and make sure that your feet are not the weak link. Yes, I have seen guys launch on deployment with brand new boots as well as those trying to squeeze one more mission out of a favorite pair, only to have them fall apart in the boonies. Everyone laughs at them, or curses them, depending on the situation. Don't be that guy.

Remember, what is on your feet doesn't complete the mission. What is inside them does.

TR

The Reaper, I think you nailed the major point. Too many people try to buy the short cut to success/conditioning. There are whole markets that rely on them to make a living.

You're both right. I think too many people in our society today will pay whatever you ask of them for that "BOX-O INSTANT GRATIFICATION", rather than the work-up to success method.

Hey Java Dude:

Links to pics don't work anymore. Want to upload some of them so people can see them?

Thanks!

RL

I just got a pair of the Bates M9's and I found that they do not run large. If you are planning on ordering a pair you will find that most companies offering this boot have them drop shipped from Bates. This could present problems if you have to return them as it will slow down the process. If you take size 11 medium forget getting them until July 06 unless the company you're dealing with has them in stock. I'm lookong forward to taking them to the sand box to see how they hold up. They feel good but I'm not going to critique them until they have had a chance to be tested in the field.

OK, so I'm going to Whistler to ski in a few weeks. I take it that these are adequate snow boots for walking around, and way better than the Oakleys? I thought about getting some snow boots today, then thought I should just wear these. Please tell me if I'm wrong.

When your walking in 3 to 4 different envoriments you what you pay for. Price makes the difference.

From MAX TABs know so well. If you have a good 18C on your Tm; he'll get just about anything. Do you memos or your CARPs and you'll get just about anything.

I have a few buds here that are wearing the Bates M9 and the oakleys.

They both seem to hold up under moderate use (no long rucking etc) for about 6-7 months. Ive seen quite a few guys wearing the Converse too.

We have a Lt that just busted a sole on his Oakleys after 9 months including MOB. Theyre still wearable.

Ive been wearing the Wellco desert style jungle boot which have been holding up outstandingly. Only prob is theyre not the most comfortable as the soles seem paper thin. Some guys have had them resoled on leave with the ripple soles and love them.

I think Ill try the Bates M6 or the Converse Persuit just for fun, then write a review at the end of tour.

Im thinking for hard use the Wellco jungle style desert boot with ripple soles is probably the best for hard use over here. They come in half sizes and narrow widths too-

The jungle boots, including the issue ones, have no cushion in the sole at all.

Drop a set of Superfeet or better yet, the Sole Footbeds in and get a decent pair of socks like the Ingenius and they are great.

Just my .02, YMMV.

TR

I would be grateful if someone from 10th Group could answer the above stupid question. :)

Haven't tried the Sole inserts (yet). I'm a big fan of Superfeet. Gave my mom a pair for Christmas last year, she thinks they're better than the perscription orthotics she used to use.

Sir,
Thank you for the advice-

Does anyone have any advice on REALLY good cold weather boots?
TFM

Good Cold weather boots.. Well what will you be doing and what is your price range too. Your active(s) will drive which kind to get. :munchin

Try the search button.